EZ Server

I see in the database the pets table has an equipment set field and there are pet_equipment tables to create those sets.

Would be interesting to make certain tier/epic pets auto spawn with certain equipment that has worn effects like stonewall or something.

Will experiment with that at some point in the near future.

Also will probably create addition quest of Casters Guild and/or Essences to make Pet classes worth having for DPS without pet dying, but also without OP making Warriors obsolete.

how about having a new mage summon spell i know on live it got to the point where you come summon +hp/strikethru armor for pets..maybe give them a new summon spell which summons a bag of weapons to give pets and a bag of armor to equipt htem with? make them tradea ble so they could have a small market out there for it...and have the spell like T6 only and very rare to drop type thing? idk just an idea

I could make summon armor but not tradeable. Players need to earn the right for their own pets to be powerful, not get fast n easy power level from a high level pet character.

I say it is probably time for Fireblade 3.0 (time willing). It would be nice to let mages have a halfstep up to compensate for their summoning goodness. (i.e. Fireblade 3.5 :-P)

-Hate

At what point do pet classes struggle? Maybe T3/T4? If so I can use that flag for the FBv3 to add a 65% stonewall or something.

65% stonewall is overkill to the max for pets!   ;D


A tiered item like this maybe??

(http://i574.photobucket.com/albums/ss189/jdub1337/EQ000087.png)



30% stonewall for all ranks... but the Slot 1  Max damage modifier would scale with each rank up?

Stonewall would only affect melee too.

Could make buff with high resist? I think the Shaman buff can increase resist cap? Then pets would get higher and higher resist until eventually the NPC AOE's that have -1000 resist would get resisted.

Its not spell AoE that chunks pets. Its the flurry/ramp that happens to all frontal targets. T5 is the point where 90% of all pet classes become obsolete due to this. The necro pet is the only one with survivability (and barely, if that) in t5+ unless youre spot on with pet positioning. My experience is only with the 4.0 and below pets, so Ive no experience with the 5.0+ in t5 and above.

Pets are eating it on the backside too.

Giggity...



But on a serious note.. after 4.0 ... the 5.0 and 6.0 pets seem pretty good at surviving to me.


I do remember trying to do corals with a 4.0 pet and 20 minutes later I logged off my pet classes and did it without them.

Being fairly new to T5, yes, T4 magician pets do die fairly quickly with necro pets a bit better due to lifetap proc.

I'd like to see mages get some summoned armor with significant hp boosts or stonewall affect on there (assuming of course pets receive benefits from gear on EMU).  In lieu of that, FBV3 please!

I still use a mage in T5 because only because I'd rather not lvl up another toon. And ya the mage pet eats it constantly, necro not as much but still has survivability issues. Problem with summoned items n stuff is downtime.  With pet class epic cast times being so brutal it adds a ton of downtime, let alone buffing getting Fireblades up, then summoning armor would be too painful. Would be better if they spawned with the items already equipped (can this be done and if so Tier appropriate items of course).
Just a thought.

Summoning the armor sets beforehand solves that. Yes, it would be a pain in the ass, but if they have stonewall or something on em, the frequency to summon them wouldnt be bad at all.

My necro's pet gets waxed by rampage in HoH rather frequently. Maybe add the FBv3 with the HoH/T3/T4 flag, or at least the Stonewall.

And instead of summoned armor, couldn't it just be done FB style? Hail them to equip?

Maybe starting with T3, creating a three pet permanent Stonewalls.

Mage Pet Stonewall - ~55%
Other Pet Stonewall - ~25%


Mage pet would obviously get the large one as they are defined by their pets. Necromancers, Enchanters, Beastlords would get the the other Stonewall. 100% uptime and undispelable.

The necro could receive ~15-20% more HP than Mage pet to add that lifetap-tank dynamic.

Enchanters and Beastlords would simply be given the 25% to keep pet alive, but to encourage them not to live by the pets.


-Hate

That sounds like it could be promising, I'd like to see how it plays out.

I still like the idea of having mages summon some pet gear that is above and beyond what is available to other pet classes to help distinguish them even more.  Yes, they could be given to other classes, but it would be another reason to have a mage around, to replace those weapons when the pets should die.  And with some improved survivability, it shouldn't be a tedious task to constantly recast and requip pets.

Maybe keep the FBV2 as is on all pets and give mages a new weapon summon spell that is the FBV3?

I like this solution, or some variation of it. The real trick is to keep the pet from being one- or two-rounded. Outside of me being an idiot and forgetting to dispell AoH damage shields, that's the only time I see mine taking a dirtnap.

I see the appeal of summoned gear, especially to people with mages, but the idea of having to keep a second pet class around to keep your own pet class viable is a little... something. I think mages should be able to equip their own pets with something better than what others can get just by flags, but I don't think it should be done at the expense of baseline improvements for other classes' pets.

I would say use the pet armor as an "added" bonus.

I could replace the Monster Summoning T2/T4/T6 with summoned armor. Set the pieces to NONE/NONE so players could not equip, each piece adding a decent chunk of HP. This way the mage still keeps their role as the dominant pet class, but their presence improves the performance of pets they touch (no homo).


-Hate

Sounds good Hate, I'd say move forward, of course that isn't my call to make  ;)

I was not saying not to buff all pets, just saying mages essentially are defined by their pets, they should have the coolest most bad ass ones available and as it stands, they don't.

I do like replacing the monster summonings, while cool, it doesn't really add anything useful to the class.  My mage still doesn't have any the higher damage spells after way too many T3/4 kills so that combined with the pet dying quickly in T5, he is getting dusty.

Shylo's Bolt of Doom may be receiving a small bonus to it's drop chance. The Mage also has a T5 nuke available as well (within a day or so, once the bossman updates loot tables).

The challenge to remember here it to not make it so the pet IS the class. Too often (in the past) the pets were so powerful that there was no reason to do anything but "set it and forget it".

-Hate

I love what you're doing, Hate. It's nice to see smaller steps between the tiers for casters. Keep it up.

How about something along the lines of a focus item with different aug slots so that the pet could be customized at casting?  People could have the option of adding a higher dps aug, damage mitigation/ac, attack speed, maybe a small heal proc/damage proc, added aggro, stun, or even something to make the pet a certain class like Rogue (kind of like the original summoned pets in game).  Obviously don't make them as strong as the true classes, but it might help some people fill missing roles in their group without having to run another character

Was just giving this some more thought, what about having the mage pet proc the Calliav line of spells in combat?  It can scale up to higher tier versions as the epics get higher.  This would be different than the necro pets and be unique to the mages adding some survivability to the pet.  By having the level of Calliav scale, it would be no more game breaking than a 6.0 geared melee tearing through lower tiers.

For the record, I have the lower version of the pet neck, 12.5k hps I think, and it helps somewhat, but I am still resummoning the pet frequently in T5.

Proc is too much. The Tower of Calliav spells are scaled up decently high. Combine that with the new necklace, and the Stonewall & HoT ...I cannot see the problem. The only problems that I am hearing are those trying using 4.0 pet in T5 (yes I know that you have to kill a few thousand mobs to get all 100 bosses). In T6 I seldom hear complaints about pets and TACVI - T4 the pets are bordering on overpowered.

Do you have either of the 70+ Tower of Calliav spells?
EDIT: Tower of Calliav is 100k rune, 0.5s cast, 180s refresh
EDIT: Tower of Calliav is 200k rune, 0.5s cast, 180s refresh

-Hate

Nope, I have not gotten the drop on the new Calliav's, and yes I have the 4.0 in T5, Mage is way down the priority list on getting upgrades since his pet is frequently dead and he is usually OOM before one mob is dead using Shylo's (finally dropped, yay!)

What about having the pet starting with 4.0 proc lower, non custom versions of Calliav?  I don't have access to details at the moment, however, surely the lower levels wouldn't be overpowering. 

Regarding complaints, I'm curious how many people actually run mages?  With the reward group CoH item and Necro pets not requiring maintenance, I'm thinking there aren't many out there to discuss the class.

Of course, maybe it is all my pent up anger for years of being ignored by Verant/SoE to do anything with mages  ;)

Mages have not been ignored. Other than that one spot you are in, the mages are in a very good place. You should try and find a copy of the Tower of Calliav from T4.

With all pet classes, too many are just trying to AFK with pets and not cast. Mages cast for fairly high DPS too. To actually sustain casting DPS, you will need a mana necklace (melee have to aug, so that's about the same). The mage pet (from my understanding) is the highest damaging pet out there too.

If you put the T4 pet necklace on the pet, keep it in a group with a healer, then the pet should do fine. Yes, the necro pet doesn't require a healer (but does less damage). With the mage 5.0+, they can proc a fairly nasty pet damage bonus (which should stack with Elemental Rage).

-Hate

Sorry, didn't mean to imply here they were ignored, on live it always felt that way.

I will keep plugging along and see how it goes, as is he is currently on the back burner while the melee group gets geared up, once we have a better handle on T5 we will bring the casting classes back in.

Thanks for looking and continuing to push out new spells, always good to see caster lovin

Don't worry, I did not take it offensively. The Mana Necklace is relatively cheap (but the time investment in finding spells is less so). With the MN, the pet, and basic usage of the tools available you should find the mage to be a worthy addition.

-Hate

The pet necklace really helps a ton in T5. The biggest issue was 4.0 pets eating ramp, and while they still do its seldom a one round thing, unless something goes wrong. Thanks, H and H!

I tire of hearing this over and over.. everyone is so pissed that a 4.0 pet cannot solo in T5..yeah (2 years ago same thing was said until you power thru and get a 5.0+ pet)

I honestly wish he would turn every T4(DTs)/T5/T6 spells back on from the trash for a week or two like it was before he made it cookiedough material..

The Mage even without the Pet DPS used to put Wizzy DPS to shame period (until recent recast timers) ( oh yeah don't for get the % to twincast on epics for mage also.. yeah can be lots of DPS here with neck and boom booms. )

The Necro pet ungodly ridiculous OP period

The Enchanter pet suxxor until T5 then still meh..

Please don't expect to come and just rip through a zone with a "Pet" ... if you want to keep the pet alive.. Focus On keeping it alive and placement. ( YOU WILL NOT GET RAMPED AT ALL FROM THE BACKSIDE ). I can keep a 4.0 pet alive all day long in there with placement alone.. (if you are getting ramped .. aggro control or you honestly are doing it wrong.. remember Coral attack who ever is the closest to the Rooted mob. so just get close.. shrink and get inside of him if need be )

There has been many many AWESOEME changes to the pet classes/casters/hybrids/tanks in the last 6-8 months that have really aligned a lot of new possibilities for many group make ups.

LTPYC!

oh and yes I have many of each class except BLs..

I have to agree, the free dps from pet classes without any work is dumb. You want the dps from the pets you have to manage them. You want the dps from the pets, be prepared to tank all the adds when you can't manage to keep retargetting your pet on the adds. You can't expect to just roll up into T5/6 with a bunch of pets whose owners have barely what it takes to enter the zone and get the same thing others get from millions of plat and dozens of hours farming for mats. I know not everyone has done this, I know that there are some pet classes with a UC but by in large the majority of them are shit geared except for the required armor to get in the zone and the epic for the pet. I like it that pets die easy, it's the trade off. Now if a way is found to force people to dump dozens of hours and millions of plat into their pet classes I wouldn't have a problem with it. But, for that matter, when I walked into T5 with my 4.0 and T4 gear I got one rounded, same as your pets. That is the way it is supposed to work. 4.0 pets should get one rounded in T5. Hell until a plat sinc for pets is found so should T5 pets just not as often.

No apparently /god mode on and entitlement.. when playing a pet class is a must...

But like I said I play all classes except the BL so find what works for yourself and manage that goon.

I get it, low post count, assumed I'm new and here for EZ mode.

I have played on EZ for ~3 years off and on, beat lots of bosses the old ways and while under geared, that does not mean that providing suggestions for a class I enjoy is requesting god mode and entitlement.

Anyway, Hate thanks for your time and constructive discussion.

I don't think they were aiming it directly at you, but at the bulk of the players that run necros and afk-steamroll content. Those same necros get to T5 and QQ that they solo it.

The pets were a huge problem before (as you may remember) when it was a bunch of pet classes AFK with pets attacking, doing significantly more DPS than those that geared up their melee with augs/charms/etc.

The pets are a significant portion of the DPS (possibly too high, I dunno yet), but the caster's arsenal is finally stepping up to the plate. Maybe, in time, the pet damage will be lowered slightly (to bring the DPS of the class in to line).

-Hate

Thanks for pointing that out hate

Arthon you just happen to be the last post before I posted. Hate hit this on the head it was not pointed at you don't take it as such.

Low post count or not you have made a lot of good/great posts in your few that you have. No one is shunning you.


As such there has been a lot of love given to the pet classes, there is a fine line of balance you find yourself walking as a GM when trying to "tune" pet casters / Nuke Casters on EZ.. I wouldn't want the job ask Hate.. he normally gets a grunt and an "FU" from me in vent or /tells when trying to find this balance..

As I stated before, I agree, pets shouldnt be a free/cheap tradeoff to people who dont want to farm. It SHOULD take some effort and time and cash to make them viable, as I suggested. But they SHOULD be an alternative. The concept that I just HAVE to roll a monk, or a rogue, or a zerker to be viable dps is absurd....just as it was absurd that at one point here you damned near HAD to be a warrior to be DPS. And, as I suggested, devise ways to improve pets that DO take time and effort.

And, again, I really didnt see where anyone was whining that they couldnt pet solo T4+ content. I certainly wasnt, and I didnt see where the others were, either. I think necros being able to solo content to 3.0+ is rather silly, as well. But does that mean you then make the class almost worthless later in the game? There has to be an alternative. Thoughtful balancing could provide it.

This hasn't gone unnoticed, it's just a simple matter of HUGE time investment to fix (which I don't have at the moment and Hunter doesn't with T7 development).

As for necros being worthless later in the game, you may not have a Sorc50/UC on it. The DoTs have been recently scaled up to be excessively powerful. I actually balanced around them being the higher(est?) DPS when fighting bosses as they take a good bit to get up and maintain their DoTs.

Thank you for the input. :-)

-Hate

Pet Classes

Multi-zoned questing for items and/or spells that improve individual casters. It would force people to focus on ONE character at a time, rather than just loading up 30 chars and going afk in t3/t4 during double loot. If you want the items to be scaling through tier, Halloween type spawns would be great. Collect an item from each spawn in each zone, combine to make an awesome item. The LDoN Mage robe is a good example of an item that provides a nice little burst of DPS, but requires you to pay attention to the timer and have it unbagged to use it. Maybe a 2 minute, pet only, holy knightstrike proc with 5 minute cool down? Extended LDoN buff? Things like that would certainly make me spend a little more time and pay a little more attention to my Mages.

The idea of making something harder to play, but better overall breaks up the traditional "You should be grouping X, Y, Y,Z,Z,Z" formula and gives people a real decision to make when forming their groups. This has been done pretty well recently with Wizards/Bards. Harder to obtain is one thing, but there's always going to be a handful of people who will do it relatively quickly and then put the character on auto-pilot from there on out. Harder to play is the limiting factor.

This is coming from someone who has 3 mages and a Zerker simply because I haven't felt like doing Augs yet. I know after a certain point this is not viable DPS and I'm already working on Monks, etc., but being able to have a viable mage or two after doing some aug-like questing would be pretty cool.

Why not simply strip the pets of their innate abilities and add class-specific, must-equip items to the crafter's guild with clicky buffs that add procs, etc?

Meh, necros can only solo previous content. Other pet classes do more DPS so it seems a fair tradeoff that necro pets can take a hit better. Also, I have to ask why so many are having problems keeping their pets alive. Are they not having their pet attack from behind the mobs or something?

Question for hate - is it intended that the enchanter spell vampiric thunder doesnt affect necro pet procs?

Plus spell effects and plus healing do NOT affect pets. This is an intended setup on the source side. Secrets did recently add an effect to specifically cause a new slot ID to act as SpellPower and HealingPower but ONLY for NPCs. In a few weeks/months when the source is updated, I will look in to this.

-Hate

It would be cool to be able to give pets gear, even if it's just rot gear you don't care about. Would be even cooler to have a /cm petinv command or something like that to display what the pet has equipped, with links to the gear. I know other emus do this, so it would be cool to see it here too.

Pets have recently been given gear.

Summon Phantom Necklace of ____

Summon the necklace, trade to your pet or other pet's owner (and they give to their pet). It adds a huge amount of hp. Gogo.

-Hate

Where can the necklace spell be obtained

T2, T4, T6

Each one adds a significant amount of health, but only the highest goes into effect.

-Hate