EZ Server

Creating a new thread so we stop derailing other threads. Will start gathering the other info here, and will start working some parses for some real data to compare.

Reserved for Data Soon

Hear hear!! Not only is the pally thread getting hijacked but the SK side is getting ignored. I love the way 90 % of the people with negative thoughts to SK improvements play pallies and warrs :) no shit! i never saw that curve ball. All of you negative nancies are going away from the fact that Pally, as poor as they once were, are now a better option. Its ok saying, well druids this and enchanters that, they will get their day. At present there are 3 tank classes.

Warr = Overpowered
Pally = not overpowered but balanced
SK = Awsome solo no heals, grp tank and benefit to grp not as good as see the two above.

Who the fuk wants to solo, we cant kill jack even if we wanted to. Try soloing a T1 boss and phone me after christmas when its 90%. All our heals do is balance out the fact warriors got discs. Grp benefits zero, dps next to zero.


What parser do people use on EZ? Ill give you some stats! I recon you will understand then.

Personally I think that all SK's really need is a boost in the proc rate, slightly, as it seems there is just too many times where I'll be tanking no prob, then no proc for a couple rounds and then plop... Possibly a slight lower of our actual damage (maybe down to 5k) but up the rate by 25%... AND make the Sorc charm affect the damage done by the tap, but not the healing part. That way we can choose to either tank better with an Oracle, or up our DPS with a sorc as well as proc slightly more often.

I also found it weird that we only get 1k regen on our epic when we can only use one of them, compared to the Warrior... or hell, even the ranger lol So I'm all for an epic 3.0 shield, or a beefed up 2hdner

Terrorantula on 20/06/2010 in 309sec

Total
 --- DMG: 536806 (100%) @ 1737 dps (1737 sdps)
 --- DMG to PC: 69263 @236dps

Moot
 --- DMG: 471230 (87.78%) @ 1525 dps (1525 sdps)
 --- DMG to PC: 65788 @225dps

Libann (Moot)
 --- DMG: 65017 (12.11%) @ 212 dps (210 sdps)
 --- DMG to PC: 1486 @59dps

Gear is 3.0, no aug, LDON/QVIC/TACVI gear, no oracle charm.

Will post more as I progress.

I am working some parses now.  For parses lets make sure that we are always comparing apples to apples.  I also don't like taking content away from the tier of players that the content was designed for.  What I propose is that you use the practice dummy in the epic 2.0 zone.  It has the same defensive stats as one of the T3 bosses.  This gives us a good baseline, we are comparing apples to apples AND we can get in 20 minute parses to rule out RNG variance.  I will post my results in a half hour.

This is a solid idea.

Sorry for the newb question.  What are you using to measure the DPS?

GamParse is what I use to parse fights.  Google it, it's the first hit.

The following parse ran for 15+ minutes.  All characters were buffless.  All characters are full T2, max AA, ROA 100, 3.0'ed.

Tretter (warrior): Used Sorc charm 10.  One 3.0 had two Anger V's, one had one Anger V and an Anger IV.
Trukum (shadow knight): Used Oracle 31.  Had +dmg aug in 1hs 3.0.
Amberr (paladin): Used Oracle 25.  Had +dmg aug in 1hs 3.0.

(http://i47.tinypic.com/333coy1.jpg)

Now had Tretter had two swords with Anger 4s AND his Sorc 25 his single target (which is what this is testing) DPS goes up significantly.  To put this into perspective, 72.5% of Tretter's damage comes from Anger aug procs.  That is 2461.5 dps out of 3393.7 dps coming from Anger procs alone.

So if it is a single target fight, Tretter is doing 3400 dps and Trukum is doing 900 dps.  Make this fight a boss + four add type fight and Tretters DPS is (2400*4) +3400 and Trukum's is still a paltry 900 dps.

Would it be possible to change SK's proc from single target Lifetap to a AE Lifetap+PBAE DD?  I think that a large AE Lifetap would be too over powered.  So make the AE Tap pretty small, but the PBAE DD pretty significant.  Depending on how they scaled they still shouldn't be preferable to Warriors as tanks, but atleast they could offtank adds (since the AELT/PBAEDD won't have agro component.)  It takes them from being mostly useless to at least partically attractive.  That is my suggestion for Shadowknights.

Put a 31 oracle on tretter and see how his dps goes.

Ya yellow, I agree, some kinda of AoE would be really good, IDK how this sounds but just pop up, would it be possible to add a more powerful pet to the SK? Im not talking about as powerful as mage or bst maybe but powerful enough to actually live through things and deal damage? Maybe that would increase the SK a little, a Knight tank with his minion to do dps

Do SK pet allow them to buff like other pet classes?

The issue with that is even the pure pet classes have issues keeping their pets up.  So that isn't really an end all be all solution.

If they join the casters guild, yes.

You can self-buff yourself through Casters guild flag yes.
They can equip the flaming swords aswell.
But they aren't high enough to proc the swords.
At least give us the CG pet then, wich is more dps then our boney friend.

But yes i agree SK's need a big upgrade.
We don't have to be on parr with a warrior for tankability.
SK's have always been trash tanks, meaning aoe trash while raid takes down the main boss.
I don't mind keeping this role , but give us some AOE ability then, and not just our jolt line,
wich isn't enough when you have to keep aggro off healers.
Maybe an 2min cooldown ability to aoe heal ourselves and group.
Don't make it as powerfull as our self heal procs, but significant enough to be on parr with pally's now.

Keep the warrior as best dps, main tank. That's their role, always been.
Keep the SK on parr with the Pally as aoe trash tanks, that's our role, always been.

That's my rant, thank you for listening.

Delirium (Warrior)
Sharonn (SK)
Muze (Bard)
Sherekan (Beastlord)
Anikha (Cleric)
Morihei (Monk)

By your post it sounds like your saying jolt has an aoe taunt component on it. If that is the case then you should have no problem holding agro off clerics since heal agro is severely reduced. My monk can hold agro off of my cleric with just melee agro.

Both Shadowknight and Paladin have 2 Aggro spells that they would normaly use for tanking. Terror of Discord is Single target for 250k hate and the same ammount of hate in AE form using Dread Gaze. Both 0.5 sec cast to prevent the spells from Locking up on a fizzle and 2 second recast.

You can be in either guild to utilize the pet as a buff-bot feature, as I'm in FG and can do it.  I'm not in CG yet.

Amusing, keep warriors as best dps and main tank?

Is there a chance since you get the best of both worlds we can just give warriors a magic 100% of damage comes back as healing? I mean hell, you already have and want everything else....

Seriously, I just think we need an AoE of sorts, or some kind of stackable DoT system.

On AoE system, something that allows us to do either minor splash damage or some kind of leaping DoT that can bounce from target to target (being spread by our AoE taunt, and causing massive threat if say Target_A is infected = true, cause 2x threat). The rolling DoT system below would also be nice if an SK could spread it.

Everytime a Lifetap procs (of any sort, buffs, sorts, augs), the shadowknight builds up a DoT that does 20% (amount can be adjusted to prevent breaking SK or if dmg is too low) of the Lifetap over 9 seconds. As each Lifetap procs, the DoT timer resets and adds the new amount. This will eventually turn into a very VERY significant amount of damage, however not quick enough to make it extremely overpowered.

EX: My SK decided that Dragon Slave looked at him funny and decided to teach him a lesson. I hit the trusty auto attack button and cast my Lifetap DD that does 1300 (260 over 9), about 4 seconds later my sword procs for a 6900 (now 1640 over 9). A swing later my Discord buff procs another 600 (1840 over 9). About another 3-4 seconds and Lifetap DD is up and lands a weak 891 (2018 over 9). Suddenly my sword decides this is getting old and drops a 13800 (now 4778 over 9). Now let's skip ahead and assume every 5 seconds Discord does 600, my Lifetap DD does 1000 every 10 seconds, and sword does extra 6000 every 15.
That is (600 x 12) * 0.2 = 1440 over 9 from Discord.
That is (1000 x 6) * 0.2 = 1200 over 9 from Lifetap DD.
That is (6000 x 4) * 0.2 = 4800 over 9 from Sword.
For those of you keeping track, that brings our dot up to 12218 over 9 after the inital ~25 seconds plus our simulated 60 seconds (totaling ~85 seconds). Assuming ticks are 3 seconds a piece, our dot is doing 4072 (rounding down) a piece. Although this is still low, it allows room for it to become obscene on longer fights. This will also give us that insidious build up feeling.
Also it adds a RNG feel as 9 seconds without any type of Lifetap DD (be it nuke, sword, or discord) and the DoT fades. This will make fights slightly less mechanically and slightly more amusing. Players can (may be required) to save their Lifetap DD to ensure the DoT rolls.


Lastly, this leaves room to improve shadow knight gear with bonuses to DoT damage. I used 20% as a baseline and can obviously be turned up or down. If say T2 set had 10-20% bonus to DoTs a PIECE, then not only would the rolling DoT be useful, but the other 3 DoTs will become usable on longer fights for significant bonus as opposed to just something to cast.

Just random thoughts and such.

If this idea goes in, lemme feel your love, toss me some oracles to Verlorenen!

A tic is every 6 seconds. The idea you are suggesting is impossible within the contruct of eq if i understand you correctly.

Hmm, i know its been a while sence i played WoW, but that sounds awefuly alot like how Death Knights in WoW tank .......

I was thinking the same thing. That or diablo or something. Couldn't word it without throwing out a wow insult so I left it alone. Doh, there, just did it.

I wasnt insulting WoW, personaly i still like it, but that kind of System is only something WoW's spell system can handle on how it treats NPC's.

Meh, in all fairness it is a good suggestion and would be neat if it would work. It would actually be a really good benefit to all dot classes.

Hmm, I understand the spreading would be obscenely difficult. However the rolling DoT wouldn't be overly difficult, unless I'm gravely mistaken. (Also I am aware WoW has a similar mechanic, I am referring to something that spreads the current dot instead of just some trash minor dot to look cool. Basically being able to spread a moderately built up DoT to other NPCs nearby [if current dot is 5000 over 18sec on Master of Weaponry and it is spread, other mobs in AoE range now have it]).

It would be something like (for single target dot): (hush Secrets, I know my C++ skills are...well what skills)
SK_AIDs_counter is a running total
SK_AIDs_spell is the total amount decreasing per tick (if such is needed)
SK_AIDs_spell_duration is hurrdurr the duration on it
spell_cast is the spell being casted
Lifetap_DD is just a junk variable to represent a test to see if spell being casted is a lifetap direct damage


Minor changes, as I was informed ticks are 6 seconds, change duration to 18 seconds.
Again, with ticks at 6 seconds and duration at 18 seconds, changed amount to 30% (may still need to be higher to be truly effective, probably as high as 45% but probably no higher as it could lead to eventual stupidity mode later).


I apologize for any breach of coding etiquette or form. I am just a gimp beginner in C++ so ...yeah, sorry.

-Hateborne/Verlorenen


EDIT: After 3 quick 1min autoattack sessions with chambersb practice dummy, 15-25% is more appropriate. Assuming 30% of Lifetaps into DoT with 3.0, all AAXPs (1149), qvic gear with tacvi chest/feet, and oracle L4 charm: in 2 of the 3 one minute combat rounds, the DPS bonus was roughly 900 (+/- 100). Obviously with longer combat the DoT could easily spiral WELL out of control at 30%. However, this has potential to turn SK into a build up DPS that although will not touch warrior burst/aoe in the slightest, will do much needed things for the longer duration fights.

Below is the first round of the one minute fight sessions. This is why 30% is probably too high. This is again, short off-hand math with very small test data. I do not claim PERFECTION or mastery of my suggestion, just to help clarify and such.

-For Numbers People-
Sword: 6900 x 7 = 48300 * 0.30 = 14490
14490 over 18 sec at 6 sec between ticks: 14490 / 3 = 4830 per tick or 805 dps
Discord Buff: (529 x 6) + 1058 = 4232 * 0.30 = 1269   (1058 was crit)
1269 over 18 sec at 6 sec between ticks: 1269 / 3 = 423 per tick or 70 dps
Nuke: 1184 x 5 = 5920 * 0.30 = 1776
1776 over 18 sec at 6 sec between ticks: 1176 / 3 = 532 per tick or 65 dps.

Total damage for the rolling DoT would have been 17535 over 18 seconds. That breaks down to 5845 a tick or 974 dps over 1 minute.

very well laid out, this could be an acceptable option but I might be missing the obvious...what about single mob encounters, it doesnt seem to offer any upgrade. Then again I am wayyy tired. any other ideas?

NM i just REread everything, if that stacking AE dot would be possible to code in..that would work very nicely I think. I do think that the numbers on the 3.0 should still reflect that of the dual wielders getting double the HP and other stats. A pretty good upgrade back in the day is when Hunter took my suggestion and made the 2hs tradable to 1hs to allow for bashing and better stats with an offhand. But to my knowledge no shield of other holdable offhand matches the stats off the 3.0, it was a good patch but not a final solution. Now since Paladins have had a superior upgrade to balance, something similar should be in order for the SK's

all good suggestions so far in this thread =)

Unless there are some either high end bonuses to lifetap through gear or some exceptional SK-only augs with a high single target lifetap, 30% may honestly be the right amount. I am just watching and kind of guesstimating high warriors and rangers...and hell, 30% may even be low.

Basically, we need to find out what all exists in t2/t3/t4 for shadow knights and augs, and then do some theorycraft (well technically, theoryquest'ing I suppose).

The Lifetap Rolling DoT (which I have amusing been calling Sineous Touch) would do very well to be disease based. For further exceptional use of coding, I am unsure but would like to see if a mechanic is possible to allow it do a minor resistance check and convert the damage to poison. (i.e.: Fippy Darkpaw has a 50 in poison resist but 75 in disease. Sineous Touch applies itself as a poison based DoT.)

However the above about differing or "intelligent" spells are just something that caught my attention.


I would greatly appreciate Secrets, Akkadius, or possibly Hunter taking a peek into my pseudocode and into current state of game to see if a rolling DoT proc'ed/started from lifetaps is possible.

Regardless, I would like to see some Lifetap augments. That would help the shadow knights a good deal.


Thank you.
-Hateborne/Verlorenen

What you suggest would require how spells function to be rewritten.

Hunter and Akkadius don't code in C++.

Hunter has also mentioned before that SK's have a super life tap. I doubt he would do something that would make it even greater than it is

The Rolling DoT is essentially a DoT, not a lifetap. However, after a decent discussion with Akkadius the Awesome, he assured me that such massive overhauls would be needed, that this is unlikely to ever happen.

Sorry all.

-Hate

poopers

resolved

resolved

poopers

resolved

poopers

resolved

poopers

not poopers

Secrets, you are very well spoken. =)  <3

poopers

Just to get this topic back on topic,

This is an example of a DoT that will spread to other nearby players/NPCs. goodeffect has to be 1 for this to work on the spell. It's clickable off on players, but NPCs are too dumb to click it off. This also means you should watch your dispells on NPCs that have it!

so many events that I had no idea existed!

very very nice!

Secrets, impressive and thank you.

Now if only the actual Rolling DoT could be sorted out, we're in business.

Secrets, if you get this to work, I'll reward you with 15pp, some worthless foraged junk, and keys to Uxt's house.

-Hate

who doesn't have a key to Uxt's house?

They're a recent addition by KLS. Spell quests (she pointed them out to me :p)

Touché Reed, touché.

Rolling DoT implemented. Need Sorc charm for dmg to mob, or Oracle charm for healing to PC that 'contract' the spell. Or, Ultimate Charm for best of everything.

<edit> Looks like the dmg to mobs portion isn't working correctly yet but a fix is in the works!</edit>

I mail them out every week to random players, but they all are sent back. :(

Poopers!

I verify that the Proc has taken a significant decrease in power down from Lifetap proc from ancient life drain 3.0. The proc rates seem about the same to me though. On the AE click can we change the spell name to something else besides: "spreading crud"..... just sounds lazy and gross. What about plague mist or archonosis =D something darker and frightful!

And after looking at the actual spell file even though it is broken at this point the stats are not up to par and really need adjustment!

Here are current stats: Spellid#7867 SK epic 3.0 click
Duration:0.8 minutes
RecoveryTime:0.00 ReCast time:0.00
Range:20 AERange:20
Slot 1: Increase Disease Counter By 3
Slot 2: Decrease STA by10
Slot 3: Decreases Hitpoints by 3 per Tick

The Sk spell Dark constriction has 3x the force as this 3.0 click? Ya I would really say this epic click needs some beefing up. Infact that lvl66sk spell has an additional slot for ac reduction of target on it!

I suggest at minimum altering the 3.0sk click (Spellid#7867) to reflect something like this:
Duration:0.8 minutes
RecoveryTime:0.00 ReCast time:0.00
Range:20 AERange:21
Slot 1: Increase Disease Counter By 25
Slot 2: Decrease STA by 75
Slot 3: Decreases Hitpoints by 666 per Tick <----MUhaha nice dark touch huh?
Slot 4: Decreases STR by 75
Slot 5:Increases Hate by 50000

These are based off the idea of the originating Disease DOT that SK's have at lvl 66, but bumped up some to reflect lvl 70 AND the increase that a 3.0weapon should have. I don't think it is perfect, but I think it is a good modification to show what the spell should be on such a upgraded weapon whilst staying true to the lore of the shadowknight.

And for those right off the bat the total damage base would be only 5k hp damage over the course of 49 seconds, of which most fights durations dont even last that long. SO this makes the SK very useful in long fights. And is not overpowering because most mobs have over 40k total with bosses scaling from Potime to be about70k on up to 100k and more up the zone ladder. So only doing about what...12%of a mobs total Hp?

Not overpowering, not underpowering..

If anything I think the other modifiers are just right, just not too sure on the damage per tick. I think it would be ok, but the only thing i think should be up for debate over.

So what yall think?

p.s.- JUST took notice that this class also should have a focus of disease spell like pure healers get focus of healing...hell even the hybrid pally gets focus too. So can we get that updated as well, it would make our spell line somewhat useful again.

Haven't hade a chance to test this out on any boss mobs (working a new job)
But the spell file info does appear underwhelming. One thing I don't know if someone wants to do the math, how does the decrease hitpoints 3 scale with charm and other available effects? How much max damage are we looking at in the later stages of the game? Over the mentioned 49sec? How about the hps on the healing side?

Forgive any spelling, big fingers + tiny droid keyboard

It's broken not because of the spellfile, but because of a perl script that determines the effects, not the spellfile itself. The only thing the spellfile determines for spells is the duration and targettype if they have a perl script applied to them. This was a recent addition to the emulator which is why you've never heard about it anywhere else.

Your assumptions that the effects on the spellfile are actually the ones getting applied are wrong.

It's a 8k heal over time for the group in AOE at the moment, and it's getting changed.

well it cant be tested at the moment cause it wont stick to NPC's. At the moment all it does is decrease overall hp by -1 for the duration and take the listed STA down by its said amount.

it is quite broken, but hopefully it will get fixed and implemented with the stats I suggested.

THe heal/ proc has nothing to do with this click effect it is a stand alone spell, so the integration of this with the healing portion of the HP taps we have does nothing to increase or decrease it .

I dont bother at this point to do the HP conversion with the charms because all the other epic effects are built from stage one as far as I know...not in reverse. I.e.- starting at max out buffs/t4 armor/ultimate charm and omega stone. That is pointless cause these concerns are for the starting out point all the way TO that progressive point. And logistically if it is not overpowered at the starting point...then there is No WAY it will be overpowered at the near end point (with all charms and max armor, so on and so forth). Especially with the way mobs scale in progression here.

But by all means if someone wants to spend the time doing all the end game equip and items to see what end result of the above proposed formula would be go right ahead....but I think it would be a waste of time because not everyone has end game gear.

Ohhh, I see.


Wait, I thought it was determined that the click was going to be a PBAoE dot of damage..not heals? Isnt that the idea behind paladins, the group heal?

wouldn't it be more fitting to a Shadowknight to spread a disease to those around him rather than heal them, and to go with the Pbaoe Dot ?
not that a 8k (or edited less powerful) group heal wouldnt be badass though.

i dunno, i actually really like the idea of a group heal...but kinda kills the image of a SK, no?

I have offered more help and ideas to hunter than you even know about. I mean you decided to make your post in my thread, so I deduct you are talking about "whining" is considered directed at me and those IN this thread. It is kinda douchey that you think that all the people responding are not willing to put in more work than "hey, this would be cool". Well that is not the case here, if it makes you sleep better.

I can't completely vouch for others posting their ideas here, but I know I put in the time to test all the areas of a suggestion I can. And infact I have and have submitted parses and whatever info I have gathered to help resolve any issues or to follow through with my suggestions for balance and upgrades.

I use GAMparse and I think it supplies ample numbers, I assume you think its crap or that there is something wrong with using that to report any discrepancies?

I mean you barked at the people in this thread but you yourself didnt off any solid test finds of the subject at hand.\

Do you have anything to aid in the resolution of these matters contain herein? If not, thanks for your point of view, but that will be all we need from you in this thread!

I would hope you do offer up the end tier results, Ive been busy on the overall gerenal population side adverse effects. SO do you have any important data to post here again? Btw yellowbird, I personally have never questioned and/or cared about your status/"influence" with anyone. Im glad you think you contribute, keep up the good work =)

But I am fully being a indian in this matter. Atleast Im trying to be.

"I mean you barked at the people in this thread but you yourself didnt off any solid test finds of the subject at hand."

I posted long ago relevant parses for similarly geared characters.  For someone so concerned with the state of Shadowknights I would think you'd, you know, have read this thread fully.

I wonder if there is a way we can banish people to only being allowed to post in the RL picture thread.

I already read those findings.

But already posted way before that posting of yours that, SK's already had a low dps output. But hunter told me in email that was how they would probably stay since they were not meant to match the other pure melee classes and they have spells to help DPS. This was before I had parsing, I could just tell the difference with intelligence from other classes performances. But back to the point...your findings only show that which everyone already knows..Sk dps is lacking.
It doesn't offer validity to the current issue of the broken epic effect.
Only your suggestion at the bottom is that of relevance...and it is just that, an opinion. You ...being a chief, just like you claimed I was doing. So just stop tying to make others look bad and help the thread progress.

SO from your ramblings I gather YOU personally think and desire the epic effect be a large PBAOE DD click effect and reduce the ancient lifetap damage as well?

Because that suggestion is fine, but in true form your idea was not voiced in a way your previous post suggested I be. Where are your numbers? Where are the calcs given with ldon/pod gear charms?

IF anything give more information for what you previously suggested, like some numbers of the pbaoe DD and how much reduction on the lifetap do you think should be given?
 It is not too bad of an idea, but I think the rolling dot mentioned before me and my idea would do SK's better.

Fact of the matter is YB will never have anything good to say about anyone unless it benefits him or they are stroking his ego. Unless it is a person with obvious authority he is going to attack anyone who thinks freely instead of subjugating themselves to his point of view.

The parse was posted to illustrate where Shadowknights stand against their contemporaries.  It isn't enough to just say, "Everyone knows shadowknights DPS suck."  Protip: None of the devs on this server actively play anymore.  As I've stated in other threads; without knowing exactly where a class stands it is impossible to "balance" them.  My parses show exactly where SKs stand.  That information is useful.  That you say it is not either means you are an idiot or you don't understand the processes involved with balancing a game.  If either are true you have no business speaking about this topic.

I said the server needs more people willing to run parses and post their findings.  I never once said that anyone posting an idea desires to run the show.  I said that if you want your idea to be taken seriously you better be willing to do the work to show that it has merit AND to test any changes that come of your idea being pushed live.  Why are you nagging me about parsing an idea that I came up with?  When/if it is implement I will be happy to help tune it.

You made a blanket statement, you were proven wrong, stop trying to "win" the argument.  Focus your efforts on getting the developers the information that they need.  People will thank you and you'll have less opportunities to look like a fool.

Most of the changes that I've pushed Hunter to make have in no way benefited me or my guild.  Sanctioned independent thought is the driving force behind my guilds success.  To suggest that I stifle peoples' ability to think for themselves is nonsense.  I encourage people to come up with their own ideas and present them to the developers.  What I am saying and what I have said all along is this, "be willing to do the follow up work if you want your idea to be taken seriously."

If you go to your boss and say, "I think if we cut three positions productivity will actually increase." you better be willing to back that statement/idea up with some solid numbers.  Why would people expect any different on EZ Server?

This is the statement that I took issue with:

"But by all means if someone wants to spend the time doing all the end game equip and items to see what end result of the above proposed formula would be go right ahead....but I think it would be a waste of time because not everyone has end game gear."

It's your idea.  You think that it would help the class.  Stop being lazy and do the damn parses yourself.

That statement is true.

I already "won" when I posted my efforts and opinions in this thread towards the progression of this class and not necessarily the BASE BALANCE. That is what your findings were mainly towards. This is a different topic, if you cant understand that I dont even know how you managed to live past 2years old. Gaming mechanics is very complex, and to try to think you are the know it all shows pure arrogance of which you have already been called out for numerous times. So do EVERYone  a favor and put up or shut up. Create your own thread to muck up, because unless your next post offers any relevance to this thread don't even bother. It is a waste of time and you are threadjacking.

I wonder if we can ban people from posting that threadjack.

Lets find out =)

Btw. i never shot down your suggestion...I, infact said it was not bad.
So you should not be getting so but hurt by my words.
Just help out the thread and other people that want to play an SK.
That is all, seriously lets not waste anymore time trying to flex anymore. Cause honestly, neither of us will "win"
So help, or walk away.

(http://jiveturkey.files.wordpress.com/2009/12/mrt.jpg)

I also stated this fact:

So you see yellowbird, I am actually trying to help and find a reasonable solution.

All you are doing is posting cool pics of Mr.T

Ya, that helps you look better in this forum. I didn't count on it that you had anything else of relevance to offer to our players.

thanks

I in no way made any veiled insults to anyone in your guild nor did I ever reference your guild at all. But I see what you did there, attempting to twist my words against your guild and its members. You have made sure that you recruited people who have made it to engaging in the end game, people don't get there without having some ingenuity. My reference is the way you speak to and treat the people on this forum and most of the people on this server. Quite frankly, it benefits you to be nice to the people in your guild, but the rest of the server you strive to show people how much of a jerk you are. Now you can come back come up with a witty response and yadda yadda this or whatever but it will never change the fact that you are a jerk. It's funny, you try to bash as many people down and at the same time be as helpful as possible in a jerk sort of way to make yourself relevant. What you end up doing in the long run though is making yourself irrelevant.

I'm done.

It's not intentional. It's a bug related to the spell. I'm changing it to a rolling DoT maybe when I get a chance to change it (Hunter needs to put in the scripts for that to happen.)

It'll start at the same heal amount it heals for as damage instead to an NPC, and gradually get better as the fight goes on for a maximum of 8 ticks.

Also, get the topic back on topic, stop picking fights, etc. We're all friends here.

Rants and flames is where you want to fight

THanks for that, usually it is Really hard to smack retards that live to argue back on track once they derail.

But ya...that rolling dot sounds freaking amazing. What are these scripts you speak of though? I'm just curious.

Is there anyway that you can post the actual spell info details here so we can check it out, since the one ingame is totally wrong and misleading. MIght give the people something to have an idea of whats in store rather than a bunch of ideas dropping in this post.

sub EVENT_SPELL_EFFECT_BUFF_TIC_NPC
{
my $caster = $entity_list->GetMobByID($caster_id);
if($caster)
{
$npc->Damage($caster, $caster->GetActSpellDamage(7863, 10), 0, 4);
$caster->CastSpell(7863, $npc->GetID(), 1000);
if($caster->IsClient())
{
$caster->CastToClient()->SetFeigned(0);
}
}
}

sub EVENT_SPELL_EFFECT_NPC
{
my $caster = $entity_list->GetMobByID($caster_id);
if($caster->IsClient())
{
 $caster->AddToHateList($caster, 100);
 $caster->CastToClient()->SetFeigned(0);
}
}

sub EVENT_SPELL_EFFECT_BUFF_TIC_CLIENT
{
my $caster = $entity_list->GetMobByID($caster_id);
if($caster)
{
$client->CastToClient()->SetFeigned(0);
$client->HealDamage($caster->GetActSpellHealing(10), $caster)
}
}

So this script is fixed? just waiting on the implement?

Gotta re-write it. I'll do it sometime, just not today, i'm exhausted :p

Omg, you sleep? hehe

No, Secrets recharges.

Should be in on newly booted zones as per the update notes, let me know of your thoughts on it.

Newly booted zones include non-custom zones and instances.

I have to get the parses going, but a quick lunch time excursion saw the click's damage. first round (on the mobs it landed on) was 1 point of dmg. The second round of the DoT saw on the verge of 16k dmg, then it increased by 375 points each tick.

This was with the SK 3.0 weapon. I currently use an oracle charm. I need that Ultimate. =/

That's intentional. You should see it increasing gradually depending on the damage it calculates.

The one damage on hitting an NPC is to make the NPC aggro on you before ticking.

So, out of curiosity, I have been kinda following the new SK epic effect and stuff but because i dont have one its hard to know exactly how it works.

For what i gathered it does and AoE proc, DoT dmg on all mobs in area which spreads to anything that comes near/ mobs gathered around that lose the DoT. With this, it gives the SK a HoT as well as his group members. The Dot progressively gets stronger the longer its active on a mob.

Does this mean that an SK could potentially be invincible the more mobs he/she has on them attacking? The HoT gets stronger the more mobs are affected right? Pull a huge train in a zone (non custom of course...cough cough) get the effect on all mobs, run around collecting more mobs, they get affected, rinse, repeat, and just kite them all around til death, or tank them to death

just a thought.... half asleep and worn out from work kinda thought. im sure i have a few details wrong here, almost positive... but meh

There's no HoT effect; just a DoT.

ah okies, guess i was just imagining the HoT on it =p
thanks Secrets

Struggling to understand it totally as yet, the dot doesnt seem to do damage to mobs attacking just the mob on target?

So far with no Sorc, if this actually does effect this, I have seen a crit max for 39k.

This was random though and the dam to other mobs attacking was nothing.

Is this single target then cotrolled by how many mobs the PBAOE hits or length of time or both? The 39k crit was after a few seconds with 10 ldon 6 mobs and other hits/ticks after reached no where near.

Confused SK

DoT was nerfed. Not sure if that nerf was intentional or not. If it was intentional, I'd rather have the insta-click agro back personally.

I'm confused as well  ???


When I read this I took note number 2 to indicate that there was a healing component to PBAOE DoT.

And then I read this:


So then I was wondering if the heal component was never intended and simply a stand in effect that would get changed into a DoT at a later date.

The following seems to confirm that the heal was never intended to be a part of the rebalanced 3.0:


I love that SKs are getting some needed attention and am thankful for the bump in DPS, but I'm just not clear on what the new effect does. For instance, who will get the dot, any mob in PBAOE and then any mob that comes near those mobs?

I'm out of town on work so I can't log in and play with my new toy, so I'm dying to know what it does  ;D

Thanks again,

Kaos

ATM it casts mass boggle, generally it does 1hp dam and somtimes 39k and you die while trying to work out why you never started a warrior.. only joking I am sure this will be fixed and appreciate anything for SK.

I was also under the impression it was to be a dot come grp heal, admittedly I have yet to see any feeback from anyone with a high Sorc or Ultimate to see if this plays a role also, I myself have only a 25 Oracle.

I was in T2 last night and now find I cannot keep agro anymore, at all. A guild monk was tanking the whole night. Even with agro spells I cant tank. DPS wise I had a small increase on nameds (i think only because of popping adds) whereas single mobs there was little or no point clicking epic. A guild warr with us of same kaliber equip must have been doing 5 or 6 times more dps if not a bucketfull more. We lost instant click agro on epic so can no longer spam that, and the 2.5 I have in my inventory (that used to have leech) also has the lower dot, this is also a pointless item now.

While I appreciate the work, and I mean I really do! I would have to agree with the previous poster in this has not helped and I would have rather just had the Agro click as we did.

This I am sure will get more work and is a step in the right direction, its just not right yet.

p.s this is not a complaint, its feeback.

alrighty,

After playing with this right after launch it was where it needed to be, doing damage reflective of a 3.0 wielding character.

But today it is gimped like everyone else has noticed.


So, I took the SK to ldon for average playing ground. Took off all damage shields and all effect procing gear. Only had a guardian charm on as well. SO the only thing that would show is the damage from the dot on the epicV3.

I went through 3 rounds of singles, adds, and duos of frogs at the entrance. And my results are all the same, I am including a screenshot of the damage output of the last fight.The initial click only does 1dmg then adds 250dmg a tick till it hits 2k Dmg.

(http://i650.photobucket.com/albums/uu226/trendkilleraine/EQ000008.jpg)

 It seems as the spell does not seem to get past 2k in the rolling sequence.

It rolls back to 250dmg and starts over again.

I am hoping this is not intentional, it should keep gaining on itself until it caps out and the spell ends before it starts out at a low 250 DMG again.

It also does NOT spread to other npcs that join the fight. The only way that new npcs joining get the disease is if the SK re-clicks the epic. And some do not get within range even When you re-click because the PBaoe range is too small.

My suggestions for improvement are:
Reworking the code to make the spell more reflective of damage needed to keep up with qvic and post qvic mobs, rolling dot damage increments of 500dmg a tick building the duration of the spell to cap at 5kdmg. Let me provide you with the math to that one before anyone cries about anything.
THat would give this epic click an end total damage of 27k OVERTIME.
Considering that the trash in qvic has total Hp's of about 63k and anything above qvic has more HP....27k is nothing. But we ATLEAST need it to be that amount, but not the very very weak 10,501 total hp that the DOT currently has on it.

 IT is very underpowered and still broken at this point. It gets resisted way too much (qvic mobs resist 50% of the time)
So...
1: Increase the HP damage portion of the DOT to cap (at minimum 5k peak tap) thus equaling about 27k total damage
2: Increase the Range of the PBae (it only hits if the mob is ontop of you currently)
3: Make it Unresistable

I agree it does need to be beefed up. Are you refreshing it everytime it comes available? I wonder if refreshing it just makes it start over by chance. Have you tried it with that being the only sole damage, (even cutting out melee) so you can see how it plays out?

If you refresh it, it starts one step up each time, but still rolls over at the same point so the dps over the course are identical, just get slightly more front loaded for a while before rolling back to the beginning. It's really bad right now.

what about the agro spells the knights have?

Agree the dmg is subpar for a custom server and a 3.0 epic weapon.
Its a good idea, just needs to be a little beefier.

Ya i forgot to put I didnt attack back either....the only thing tested was the damage the dot was doing.

no damage shield, no melee attack, no spells, no procs, no charms or augments.

the damage is pure epic proc, and it is pure weaksauce.

lol.

and It cant be clicked over and over to add dot on dot, because of the refresh restriction delay of 1 minute (in real time) this delay is not on the weapon or spell file itself but it does have the delay on recasting.

And...we're only halfway fixed, or still half broken, depending on how you look at it. Supposed to have a fix pushed by Secrets but I have no clue when that will be. Might have to dust off my original warrior and play the oh so overpowered class instead.

SK's really need to be beefed up. Paladin 3.0 is superior to SK 3.0 in every way. Paladins also outdps SKs and SKs serve very little purpose in a group.

I hope something is done about this in the near future

Welcome to the club.... Enchanters,Bards,Wizzy,Zerkers,Shadow knights

fix'd

 L O L   ;D

Hey now dont kick the wizzies down, some balancing was done with them on the T3 spell a few weeks back.

Make it so, when a SK joins the CG, that their summoned pet is at least the minimum level to proc the fireblades. 

They still suck balls before that.

Who the hell is goign to waste time gearing a wizzy Tier 3? lol.

Me :P

got the T3 wiz spell? ;)

This is a great thread.  Question is this how my SHD critical hit a mob in Seb last night for 32000 !?!  I've only got the 2.0. I freaked and took a screenie cause I couldn't believe it.  Love the rolling dot idea.

Finishing Blow

Oh lol that would explain it. Thanks!