Druid update ideas

Beerman

Newbie

Posts: 30

« on: February 11, 2011, 06:47:58 pm »

Since most of the other classes have had some look at except the ~~smelly hippies~~ Druid class, I thought I would make a post with some suggestions towards where they maybe could go in the future.

Let me preface this by saying that I never played EQ on live, so I don't know how they worked specifically there but people were saying in ooc last night that they were more of a damage class than a heal class there. But seeing as this server is not the live EQ server and has a totally different dynamic that maybe breaking the "but they were always this" notions may not be a bad thing and might help this server overall.

First, I am not against Clerics at all, and it seems that now they have been adjusted to being able to, with that fancy new AoE heal spell they got (word of vivification?), be able to solo-heal a tank + group while paladins have been adjusted (rightfully so) to be group healers that will have trouble keeping a tank up through boss damage without help. The problem with Clerics is that they are yet another plate class that needs to be geared. With the buffs to Bards and the continued viability of SKs, Warriors, and Paladins (as group healers with some ok dmg) there are 5 plate wearing classes that require gearing. And since you cannot avoid gearing a tank, plate is always going to be in high demand. Leather, on the other hand, only has 3 classes on it (both chain and cloth have 4 each) which leads to more availability of drops to gear out the Druids.

Right now, it seems like pretty much everyone has a Druid with a 3.0 floating around for power leveling because the clicky HoT is very good for keeping lower level toons alive. They also all have a paladin (or more than one) as that was ridiculously OP for healing. Not everyone has a cleric floating around which goes back to the gearing issue above.

What my suggestion would be is to, instead of forcing everyone to have a cleric for tank heals that also keep the group alive is to give the druid a spell (or spells) that makes them viable single target healers to synergize with paladin group healing. Maybe something along the lines of roughly the same base heal as the Cleric heal on a similar short-cast/recast but that only works on a single target so the druid would be your classic MMO "MT bomb healer". This way, you can choose to run a 6 person group with 1 tank, 1 cleric, and 4 top notch DPS or 1 tank, 1 Druid, 1 paladin, and 3 top notch DPS but still be equally viable.

I don't like the idea of increasing the HoT personally for 2 reasons. First, it seems that ticks are hardcoded to 6 seconds in EQ and to make something that ticks every 6 seconds even remotely come close to keeping a tank alive it needs to be a level of ridiculous I don't want to speculate. Second, bosses don't stop swinging for 6 seconds at a time, so that is a long time between heals.

I appreciate all the thought everyone has put into things, and all the work being done to make adjustments. I really dig the changes to the formerly "CG/FG Camper" DPS classes and hope everything keeps getting better for all classes if only to not have to say "oh man, not another necro/wizard/monk BP"


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walk2k

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Re: Druid update ideas

« Reply #1 on: February 11, 2011, 07:23:46 pm »

Make the epic clickly a group buff would be nice, and beef it up some. Even my gimp 2nd pally procs for more than the druid epic... and it procs every 1-3 seconds not 6 seconds lol.... And get rid of the ridiculous cooldown time too.

Dunno about group heals, but a better single-target heal than chlorobon would be nice...


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hateborne

Legend

Posts: 2282

Don't nerf me bro!

Re: Druid update ideas

« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2011, 09:21:20 pm »

If those damn druids would just put down the the damn peace pipe and get a job, they might make something of themsel...ooh DRUIDS.

Seriously, I would be good for adding a minor cleanse to it's ticks to epics. This would make the target less boned by debuff spam.

Another idea is to possibly add a very heavy damage shield that requires max level. It would prevent it from being exploited at lower levels. I'm talking ~2k(ish) with 30min duration on ONE target max.

Hell, maybe even an a chance on any DoT tick to produce a MEGA heal. I don't mean a crit bonus, talking like 10k-25k base "proc". Essentially a Focus type of effect that is max level only that creates this effect. (Honestly, it would be easier to give a spell that does this and FoH so druids won't hit that buff cap just from self buffing).

Just some random ideas from the resident asshole wizard.

-Hate


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pouncer

Newbie

Posts: 41

Re: Druid update ideas

« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2011, 10:24:31 pm »

Maybe make some kind of healing damage shield that can crit, as we as giving druids a fast-casting/fast recast group heal?

I've said it once and I'll say it again. I think both they AND shaman need a type of death intervention similar to the ones clerics have. This way all three would be desired and (as pointed out in the OP) it would make less demand for plate. Nothing against clerics, I just think all three healers need equal consideration.

On a related note, is there any word on possibly making a rot NPC for tier 3 armor, similar to what we have in PoD?


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hateborne

Legend

Posts: 2282

Don't nerf me bro!

Re: Druid update ideas

« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2011, 11:56:53 am »

If shamen and druids both get a DI like ability, isn't that following the World of Warcrap route by homogenizing?

If I'm not mistaken, the knights have a DI self only.

So essentially it's just a warrior who needs it? Wouldn't the Stonewall clicky for no DI be a fair trade? Paladins get spell Stonewall (considerably less friendly), SKs get no Stonewall, but both have self only DI.

Ehh /rantoff

-Hate


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pouncer

Newbie

Posts: 41

Re: Druid update ideas

« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2011, 12:06:03 pm »

Quote from: hateborne on February 12, 2011, 11:56:53 am

If shamen and druids both get a DI like ability, isn't that following the World of Warcrap route by homogenizing?

I hardly think sharing one spell would homogenize them. The problem is most people NEED DI for MCP, why just let clerics have it? Like I said this gives other healers viability while reducing demand for yet another plate class.


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Drezden

Sr. Member

Posts: 340

Re: Druid update ideas

« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2011, 12:13:29 pm »

Really depends on Hunters vision. Does he want the classic tank/cleric for major stuff, or does he want to expand on that and give us the options of using other healing classes to do the same thing.

I think a group heal on druids and shammys is a good idea, to a lesser degree of the clerics. And slightly increase single target healing, still lesser than clerics. Then make druid click group and add better dmg shield. But no DI.

I mean think about what druids and shammy are good for, then increase whats already there, no need to really make a ton of new spells.


« Last Edit: February 12, 2011, 12:18:55 pm by Drezden »	Logged

Collector

Jr. Member

Posts: 68

Re: Druid update ideas

« Reply #7 on: February 12, 2011, 12:21:47 pm »

I don't think druids should get DI aswell.. but something other druids are known for perhaps...

Thats like saying a Knight should have stonewall imo


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Drezden

Sr. Member

Posts: 340

Re: Druid update ideas

« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2011, 12:38:29 pm »

Druids could use an increase in nuke and DoT power to a slight degree. Use the existing stuff and just expand on it, don't even have to change the name lol.

And didn't shammys on live own? I mean double dots and such? I know this is a custom server, but its not like Hunter has totally revamped any classes, like a warrior with healing spells and such. He has stuck to class theme pretty much.

Using whats already available would be quick and easy, would need slight tweaking. You could take a look at the usable, not every one, lvl 65+ spell and tweak them as needed. Then create the new ones to go above and beyond that. This would help lower tiered folks out a ton without being OP at top tiers.


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walk2k

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Re: Druid update ideas

« Reply #9 on: February 12, 2011, 01:18:12 pm »

I think you guys are underestimating the uselessness of druids for high end raids.

Their regen does 2-3x LESS than a paladin, even after the nerfs, and it's single target only (with a 3 minute cooldown or something awful like that).

Their best single-target heal is simply useless after about T1 when tanks start going from 30k-ish HP up to 100k and beyond.. I think it heals for about 10k with a decent Oracle level, with crits to 20k. Again less than a similar paladin on /autoattack /afk...

Nukes, what nukes, they have zero useful nukes. I think the best does about 3k dmg and takes forever to cast...

I got my druid the T4 or is it T3 dot (crab's rain of frogs?) it does 7200 dmg a tick (/6 secs = 1200 dps) it's actually barely passable, but not really at the level you get it at...

Druids at this point are purely RoA-bots. I don't know what time frame Hunter has for looking at druids, seems like it wouldn't be too soon with everything else going on.. but that's how they are right now..

IMO? Give druids a useable single target heal that can heal a significant portion of a tank's 100k-200k++ hps. Make the regen clicky a group (TGB able) and heal a lot more, like 15-20k a tic (after focus'es) on the 3.0 up to 40-50k/tick on 4.0 - that would mean a crit tic would have the chance to heal 50% of a main tank, every 6 secs. Very much worth casting, but not overpowered.

Give them T1-T4 AoE nuke, like a rain that does 10-25k per wave. Give them a DOT that does more like 4-5k DPS (at T1) to 20-30k DPS (at T4). Something that contributes significant damage, it would still be less than a paladin lol... They could probably even use a good damage shield too.


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walk2k

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Re: Druid update ideas

« Reply #10 on: February 12, 2011, 01:20:54 pm »

lol sorry bout the wall of text


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Agrias

Newbie

Posts: 37

Re: Druid update ideas

« Reply #11 on: February 12, 2011, 01:21:40 pm »

Quote from: Collector on February 12, 2011, 12:21:47 pm

Thats like saying a Knight should have stonewall imo

Pallies do get a stonewall

Old druids could do a bit of everything. Their nukes were decent at one point as were their larger heals (used to have a druid in the CH chain). A boost in either wouldn't hurt, but I couldn't see someone wanting one in their group with stronger classes available.


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Lexington

Full Member

Posts: 155

Re: Druid update ideas

« Reply #12 on: February 12, 2011, 02:36:46 pm »

druid heals aren't terrible, that being if they have a good oracle charm, i use my shammy to patch heal sometimes when tanking t4, her oracle charm is only lvl 1 tho, but still every lil bit helps it's a 30k crit heal or so i think. the druid regen is still good yes?