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Author Topic: Epics..  (Read 19719 times)
Xiggie | Stone
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« Reply #15 on: January 02, 2011, 04:50:07 pm »

I am not sure what you are saying. With my idea I am not suggesting the use of the magic box to do a combine. It would be a straight up aug. If anything, make the epic augs 11 or 12 type and then if there is a way to do a batch change to all weapons in the game and make them all have that slot available. I think the other ice/fire augs are 4 and 8 so they would not conflict with one another.
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L0stman
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« Reply #16 on: January 02, 2011, 06:15:51 pm »

Sorry - I think I was a bit confusing there.

One of the benefits to the epic weapons is that they contain multiple aug slots so that you can add multiple firestrike/icestrike/anger augs to them.  With your change, you would be forced to rely on the aug slots available on normal-in-the-wild weapons.

It is possible to add a new EpicAug slot to all the weapons to guarantee your epic aug will always fit on them... but... what about the additional firestrike/icestrike/anger aug slots that the players use like crazy?  Could add ____ aug slots to all weapons, but then that negates a major draw of the epic 4.0 (another aug slot).

The other problem would be in weapon delay... it would be a fight to see who can get the weapon with the least delay.  As opposed to everyone looking like they are holding warrior epic 1.0's they would be holding a mossy twig Wink

Not trying to shoot the idea down, just trying to understand how one would work around the limitations it would provide.
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TheBloodmoon
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« Reply #17 on: January 02, 2011, 07:58:40 pm »

Sorry - I think I was a bit confusing there.

One of the benefits to the epic weapons is that they contain multiple aug slots so that you can add multiple firestrike/icestrike/anger augs to them.  With your change, you would be forced to rely on the aug slots available on normal-in-the-wild weapons.

It is possible to add a new EpicAug slot to all the weapons to guarantee your epic aug will always fit on them... but... what about the additional firestrike/icestrike/anger aug slots that the players use like crazy?  Could add ____ aug slots to all weapons, but then that negates a major draw of the epic 4.0 (another aug slot).

The other problem would be in weapon delay... it would be a fight to see who can get the weapon with the least delay.  As opposed to everyone looking like they are holding warrior epic 1.0's they would be holding a mossy twig Wink

Not trying to shoot the idea down, just trying to understand how one would work around the limitations it would provide.

This +1.  Creates much more workload involved and wouldn't reliably work without a complete and total revamp of all possible weapon drops available.

Adding the option to put a weapon mold (these "molds" could be any set of 5 or 6 graphics that are currently supported by the titanium client) is much less work, easier to work with for players, and keeps the epic weapons as they are in their current state minus the option to change the graphic with a simple magic box combine with the desired "mold".  Honestly, I can't imagine a simpler process than that.  The only issue is it's a serious drain on Hunter's time for tedious work.  He needs another coder for the boring work. =P

To give more specifics to my thoughts:

If you create 5 "molds" for each epic, that's 5*(16 classes*3 epics [3.0, 3.5, and 4.0]) = 240 possible combinations (or 240 individual "copies" of each epic from 3.0 and above that has to be created in the database).

Each class epic could have 5 possible "molds" that correspond well with the weapon type.  For example: Warrior epic 3.0 could have 5 molds with 1HS graphics that look appealing as a warrior type weapon.  Cleric would have 5 molds with shield graphics.  Rogue would have 1HP graphics, and so on. 

To ease the work on this, you could limit to 5 molds that are universal for each class so you wouldn't need 5 seperate molds for 3.0, 5 more for 3.5, and 5 more for 4.0.  Just 5 usable molds per class corresponding to the epic weapon type.

Would be even easier if players submitted their top choices for weapon graphics for their class epics so Hunter wouldn't have to go digging around for 90 different weapon graphics on his own.

Honestly, I'm biased towards my own opinions, but I really think this to be a very workable solution and give more variety towards weapon graphics.  But then again, that's all just opinion. =)
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Xiggie | Stone
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« Reply #18 on: January 02, 2011, 08:01:06 pm »

It is good to know that batch adding aug slots would work. You could simply add the new aug type to each weapon as well as 4's at 8 slots. There would have to be some weapons just simply taken out of the game because of the crazy delay factor, or at least take the new aug type out of them. I imagine it would be an on going thing, but not one that requires a crazy amount of time.

The thing about getting an extra aug slot with the 4.0... not sure what to do with that. Maybe add another benefit some other way.
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L0stman
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« Reply #19 on: January 02, 2011, 08:54:02 pm »

You know.. the more I think about it this sounds pretty neat.

There would actually be -camps- outside of those in the new zones to find weapons that either look cool or have low delay and look cool etc.  Might even expand the EZ Economy a bit with that.

The problem (on top of coding time) is those blasted augmentation slots on the epic 4+... I would also have a slight concern that adding augmentation slots to all weapons (4 and Cool may be overpowering given you could then just use your /auction bought augments in crap items before you get your epic 3.0+.  Of course, this particular thing doesn't matter if there exists easy-to-get items in the wild that contain both aug 4 and 8 slots.  Dont feel like querying it right now on a stock peq db...
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Caryatis
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« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2011, 08:22:52 pm »

BTW since alot of people seem to be wondering how to support newer weapon graphics on titanium client, I posted a guide at eqemu: link

In case you wanted to option to use newer graphics for an ornamentation thing.
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TheBloodmoon
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« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2011, 08:42:59 pm »

It isn't a secret that you can batch edit items in the database.  I do get it that it makes an easy solution to some work spent.  The problem, I feel, comes in the fact that you're changing a large portion of the server's game dynamics when you create the opportunity for players to essentially add their weapons' epic stats to a completely different weapon.  It may seem as simple as adding an augment slot to each weapon in the game to accommodate it, but the complexity of it comes in the fact that you would then need to design weapon drops to follow the content also.  More specifically, you would need to go through the entire database of all possible weapon drops, and either remove them from the database if their delays or other stats create an imbalance or remove them from the list of "epic" augmentable items.  You would then need to alter the rest of the stats on the items to prevent some epics from being stronger than intended.

For example, consider the fact that some weapons currently available in Qvic have relatively decent damage to delay ratios when compared to all other available weapon drops.  Now, add an epic augment slot to those items.  Suddenly they become tremendously more powerful augmented with an epic augment.  So basically, players will be camping Qvic again for weapon drops.  Then we're back at square one where all players will be wielding the same 1hs, or shield, or piercer from Qvic and now we'll see much less diversity.

All in all, however, I feel that epic augments are a very cool idea.  In fact, I think it would work spectacularly well if designed for a server from the ground up.  Having multiple "hollow" weapons drop along the way through custom content without ANY stats at all, except for a single augment slot to place an "epic" augment (and perhaps more augment slots as you increase through the custom contents difficulty) would give MANY options for item graphics.  Of course, you're talking about creating new items in the database again, which I get the feeling is something Hunter is shying away from.

Hmmm, I'm on the fence though, because the more I think about it, the more I really like an "epic" augment idea.  I just think EZ server is too far into it's content that it's just no feasible to create such a large-scale content changing update.  Hence why I am leaning towards the epic molds/ornamentation.  As Caryatis details, we have options as players to ensure we can see item graphics beyond what the Titanium Client supports out of the box.

Sorry for the wall of text, I felt compelled to write what came to my mind.  I'm sure Xiggie will chastise me soundly for it as he loves to do.

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Balthor2
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« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2011, 08:50:24 pm »

Last couple posts are good. Caryatis thank you for that link.
Now if only there was a way to set it so
If client = seeds display item graphic 1 else display item graphic 2
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TheBloodmoon
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« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2011, 08:54:10 pm »

Last couple posts are good. Caryatis thank you for that link.
Now if only there was a way to set it so
If client = seeds display item graphic 1 else display item graphic 2

Would be fairly cool indeed....
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Balthor2
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« Reply #24 on: January 04, 2011, 12:37:36 am »

Have a few ideas and I am by far not the only person interested in this. Hopefully its possible and made working or a way is figured out to code it in.
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Hunter
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« Reply #25 on: January 04, 2011, 02:46:44 am »

Havent read whole thread yet but I can make special epic aug "type" number and "blank" weapons with different graphics. Would just take some time but it's easy. Basically dupe each epic into aug.
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Hunter - EZ Server GM
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« Reply #26 on: January 04, 2011, 02:59:49 am »

Havent read whole thread yet but I can make special epic aug "type" number and "blank" weapons with different graphics. Would just take some time but it's easy. Basically dupe each epic into aug.

Put the blank weapons as rare drops from bosses, that would be fun. Smiley
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Hunter
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« Reply #27 on: January 04, 2011, 03:32:56 am »

Farm blank weapons or maybe craft them.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2011, 03:34:30 am by Hunter » Logged

Hunter - EZ Server GM
Xiggie | Stone
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« Reply #28 on: January 04, 2011, 04:36:42 am »

Maybe have standard ones that are available on a vendor then some others that are rare drops from bosses. Additionally some others that can be crafted in the crafters guild.
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Balthor2
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« Reply #29 on: January 04, 2011, 05:48:20 am »

Oh if Hunter goes this route we could get all the cool graphics, make the weapons TRADEABLE but the augs NODROP so once auged you cant trade it.
This would provide a minor boost to the economy because I could farm for the graphic I want and maybe someone else has it and I can buy it from them.

Yes yes?
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