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[huffdady]

Ok, you number crunching experts.  I need some help setting up my 2 groups.
All of my toons are T9 gears/epic'ed.   All of them have Halloween pets from last year.  Most of the casters have Unicorn or devil, all the melee have flame mistress.  

My current setup:
Warrior (max SOA, UC3, UW9 and HateStomp3)
Shammy  UC1
Pally       1xFS XI  , UC2
Ranger   2xNS XI , UC2
Zerker    1x FS X and 1x XI , UC2
Enchy      UC2, Summoners Bag

SK       (SOA 39, UC1, No UW yet)
Cleric   UC1
Monk   2x NS XI, UC1  (yes, I know I am a slacker, working on UC2 as we speak)
Bard    T9 1 hander with IS X, Whip, UC1
Druid    UC2

What I am looking for is Max DPS and Max Survivability.  If my warrior goes down, I want my SK to be able to pick it up.  

So, do I stack up War, cleric, druid, shammy, SK and make a Bard, Zerker, Ranger, Enchy, Pally, Monk Group?   Flip the enchy and the shammy?    

Also, I have room for 1 more toon.  What do you guys suggest to fill it? 

I'm just not really sure.  Any help you guys could give would be appreciated.

[Kruciel]

What I am looking for is Max DPS and Max Survivability.

Find a way to fit a pally in the other group and add 2-3 zerkers to the roster  I did this by having my cleric / druid / shaman sit in the 3rd group and basically do nothing (well the shaman melees). Then some years later I added more zerkers and it became a full 3 groups. If you're against running over 12, just have your buff team log out after buffing, but camping the druid / cleric will gimp your survivability heavily.

Realistically, a cleric just doesn't cut it for group healing with how much HP characters end up having, so a 2nd pally is highly recommended in preparation for what t10 might dish out. My second group now just consists of ENC - PAL - BER - BER - BER - BER.

[balidet]

my second group has no healer other that aoe druid regen "when I remember" and I never really notice /shrug

no mass deaths... every once in awhile some mob will respawn or wander in at eat one of them if I am not paying attention but you really dont need a healer in your second group....try it.

[Kruciel]

2nd pally is highly recommended in preparation for what t10 might dish out.

what t10 might dish out.

t10

[WatchYouDie]

SK       (SOA 39, UC1, No UW yet)


What I am looking for is Max DPS and Max Survivability.  If my warrior goes down, I want my SK to be able to pick it up.
 
Any help you guys could give would be appreciated.

SK can not generate enough AE hate without Hatestomp aug.

Get UW or level up a 2nd war


as far as group makeup

WAR/PAL/MONK/BRD/RNG/ZERK G1 rest in g1 rest in g2 ... this make AG etc hit your dps toons ... as far as a 12th ... if you wanted to level another one up ... as krink suggested a 2nd pal wouldnt be bad but you do have a clr... so i would prob make a rog if i were to go through the trouble

[Warbash]

Personally I never found the backup tank useful. If main tank is going to die it's usually due to over pull or desynch and typically your second tank is not going to be of much help there.

So looking at your group id nix SK, ranger and bard, put extra pally as back up tank in 2nd group and add 2 more zerks. I've parsed bard and ranger in t9 with xi ninja augs and the dps is meh. Bard epic is nice pluc ac song and stuff, up to you.

[Darpey]

Parses circa January for reference...

Parse Summary

DPS shown in millions

Warbash (UC1, Strike 9 x1)
Rogue 0.47
Monk 0.44
Ranger 0.39
Beastlord 0.36 (Pet: 0.12) (TOTAL: 0.48)
Bard: 0.35

Rymo (UW11, UC3)
War 6.74 (EoBA 50)
Pal 2.82
Ber 5.35
Rog 6.65 (EoBA 50)
Monk 5.35
Ranger 3.99

Rent (UC2, max strike/neck)
Wiz: 0.40
Mage: 0.91

Warrior5
War: 0.48 (Anger 5x3, 6x1 ~ UC1 MoF)
Monk: 0.45 (NS5x2 ~ S50 ~ MoF)
Monk: 0.17 (NS5x2 ~ MoF)
Ranger: 0.16 (MoF)
Berserker: 0.09 (MoF)
Bard: 0.02 (BU)
Berserker: 0.011 (BU)
Enchanter: 0.004 (CD)
Wizard:  0.004 (CD)
Cleric: 0.0009 (IG)

Darpey (UC2, max strike)
War: 5.75 (UW10, UC3, HS4)
Rogue: 2.14
Monk: 1.99
Berserker: 1.63
Bard: 1.52
Paladin: 0.87

Aythena
Rogue: 3.04 (NS10x2, UC2)
Monk: 2.78 (NS10x2, UC2)
Berserker: 1.51 (FS10x1, UC2)
Necromancer: 1.11 (Death 3)
Mage: 0.86 (Mana Neck 10, UC2)
Bard: 0.53 (UC1)
Enchanter: 0.45 (Mana Neck 10, UC1)
Druid: 0.34 (UC1)
Paladin: 0.34 (UC1)
Paladin: 0.29 (UC1)
Shaman: 0.26 (UC1)
Warrior: 1.45 (UW8, UC2)

[huffdady]

SK       (SOA 39, UC1, No UW yet)


What I am looking for is Max DPS and Max Survivability.  If my warrior goes down, I want my SK to be able to pick it up.
 
Any help you guys could give would be appreciated.

SK can not generate enough AE hate without Hatestomp aug.

Get UW or level up a 2nd war


as far as group makeup

WAR/PAL/MONK/BRD/RNG/ZERK G1 rest in g1 rest in g2 ... this make AG etc hit your dps toons ... as far as a 12th ... if you wanted to level another one up ... as krink suggested a 2nd pal wouldnt be bad but you do have a clr... so i would prob make a rog if i were to go through the trouble

Thank you watchyoudie, I absolutely plan on getting the SK UW and Hatestomp.  These 2 groups are a mix match of toons I have created and level and benched and brought back through the years.   The SK (Aamadex) was my original tank.  I benched him for the warrior.  Since I came back and made my 2nd group I just plopped him in there. 
That is an excellent idea for a first group, I don't know why I always want to segregate the warrior from the DPS, with his UW9 he pumps out some serious DPS.  I am definitely going to give it a try. 

Thanks again.
Iamthedevil

[balidet]

Let me break down my logic and stuff
All have max strike augs

1. UC3/UW11/Max SOA/IG/ROA 650/Hatestomp2 warrior with all the toys;  no brainer master of all things
2. UC3 9.0/MF/ROA 600 Paladin; main healer does great with just procs
3. UC3/9.0/MF/ROA 550 Cleric; for spot heals and hp buff.. this toon was added back in for t10 expectations
4. UC3/UW11/9.0x2/Xpmask 300/MF/WidarcSwing2 Rogue: backstab and dps ...plus the bearer of my xp mask
5. UC3/EOA25/9.0/ROA 600/AF Zerker... AOE...aoe..AoE
6. UC3/ 9.0/ROA/AF 600 Zerk... why 2 zerks? AOE!

Second Group

1. UC3/9.0/ROA 625/MF Druid.... Regen/Skin/HP buff
2. UC3/9.0/ROA 600/MF/Summoners pack/Mana Neck XI Chanter.. VT and um...yea that pet stuff as well..used to cast GOA but I never do now
3. UC3/9.0/ROA 550/AD/Summoners Pack/Mana Neck XI Mage.. DS and um...some nukeing? with a pet!~
4. UC3/9.0/ROA 600/MF Zerk.. more AOE!
5. UC3/9.0/ROA 650/MF Monk ...um dps...and dispells for BP... that's really it...
6. UC2/9.0/ROA 500?/ Wizzy... this spot was blank until a few weeks ago now I added back in a caster ..because? I have no idea DPs is weak and still needs uc3

I am currently gearing up a shammy to replace one of the 12 toons listed.. I dont really know who yet but it wont be the cleric or druid cause...buffs i guess are good?

any questions or comments...have at it..

[Chunka]

Your biggest dps atm is the UW war, by a huge margin if you're using 2h. Two classes will add a ton to that dps: shammy and zerker. I'd keep both those characters in your warriors group. Enchanter can be anywhere to help dish damage. Pally and shammy should be plenty to keep warrior healed.

I have to agree....2nd tank is about as useful IMO as an extra pair of tits on a nun. Drop him and replace with another zerk, unless you wanna add another war and work a 2nd UW. Thats DPS and tanking.

I'll probably catch hell for this, but with Hates changes (including recent cast time/refresh changes to Death line) necros are pretty damned good ae DPS. May wanna consider one (shrug).

If you really wanna go nuts, add a rogue and make UW on them a priority. UW rogue becomes stellar dps very early.

[AcuteAnthrax]

He has a Rogue in his first group, it's number 4.

Are Shaman a substantial DPS increase? I currently run in T5:

UWIII Warrior
Pally
Zerker
Rogue
Monk
Cleric

I'm thinking of what to replace the Cleric with for the time being as healing isn't much issue right now. I was thinking of trying out a Necro since I've always been a fan of the class and my AoE damage is lacking but I also have a shaman I could bring up. Looking to optimize my best with 1 group for now until I finish up T5 and feel more willing to run around with additional characters.

[Warbash]

He has a Rogue in his first group, it's number 4.

Are Shaman a substantial DPS increase? I currently run in T5:

UWIII Warrior
Pally
Zerker
Rogue
Monk
Cleric

I'm thinking of what to replace the Cleric with for the time being as healing isn't much issue right now. I was thinking of trying out a Necro since I've always been a fan of the class and my AoE damage is lacking but I also have a shaman I could bring up. Looking to optimize my best with 1 group for now until I finish up T5 and feel more willing to run around with additional characters.

Acute,

I have gone through T5 3 times now, 1 with my original 12, then I added 6 more and I am just finishing up another group of 6. I am done in there just need some gear to move on.

Before finishing this last t5 run, I basically got my group of 18 through T9, War max UW SoA (no ear yet).

Let me tell you that this last run is as painful or maybe even more so, than the the 1st 2 times. Its far easier, I can pull the entire zone, one shot corals etc but it is still a huge time sink and boring after the first time.

This leads me to my second point, figure out how many toons you can load at one time. if that number is 10, then figure out what 10 toons you would like to have and then get them to T5. You can do it a few toons at a time but when you get to T5, load them all up and get them the gear and kill credit.

If you do this, you can pair down to a group you like or mix and match the toons to find what works for you. And as you have time or get bored, you can bring a different toon up to your current level quickly as they have already passed T5. You will also notice as you move past T5 that you want to pull more and more toons. You will look for ways to have your tank accept more damage from those additional mobs and for ways to quickly mow them down for farming and progress.

To do this you would max your SoA, use drake and regen from druid and the melee mit buff from cleric. Then you will start to want to add more AoE toons until you find a balance between single target DPS and AE. These are typically your War with UW, Rogue with UW, a monk and then a few zerkers, and a Paly in each group to keep them alive.

For those trying to min max their group or trade out one for another, I will say this, just add another dps toon, its added dps will be greater than the dps found by mixing your group makeup. Even on a crappy computer with the info on these forums you should be able to box 10+.

[Chunka]

He has a Rogue in his first group, it's number 4.

Are Shaman a substantial DPS increase? I currently run in T5:

UWIII Warrior
Pally
Zerker
Rogue
Monk
Cleric

I'm thinking of what to replace the Cleric with for the time being as healing isn't much issue right now. I was thinking of trying out a Necro since I've always been a fan of the class and my AoE damage is lacking but I also have a shaman I could bring up. Looking to optimize my best with 1 group for now until I finish up T5 and feel more willing to run around with additional characters.

Warrior (max SOA, UC3, UW9 and HateStomp3)
Shammy  UC1
Pally       1xFS XI  , UC2
Ranger   2xNS XI , UC2
Zerker    1x FS X and 1x XI , UC2
Enchy      UC2, Summoners Bag

SK       (SOA 39, UC1, No UW yet)
Cleric   UC1
Monk   2x NS XI, UC1  (yes, I know I am a slacker, working on UC2 as we speak)
Bard    T9 1 hander with IS X, Whip, UC1
Druid    UC2

Still lookin for the rogue in there. His number 4 says "ranger". What'd I miss?

And if you have a UW yes, the shaman casting grudge (even with the CD) is substantial dps increase.

[AcuteAnthrax]

@chunka sorry I instinctively assumed you were replying to the comment above yours lol

@warbash yeah I have 24 toons and currently load them all up and sit at zonein while I run around T5 with my main group for the kill credits.

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