Ultimate Weapons Discussion

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[lerxst2112]

I don't have a UW, and chances are I never will, but I notice nobody was telling Hate how much he sucked when he was adding clickies and spells and fixing broken shit.

[Chunka]

Most of us werent telling Hate he sucked. Most of us were giving feedback, and telling Hate that he didnt see the entire picture. Some of us still dont think he did. Thats NOT an insult to Hate, its just the impression some of us got. he isnt infallible. None of us are, and its often easy to miss all aspects of these issues, no matter HOW good you are.

And Hunter, please understand that IN NO WAY implies he isnt qualified to work on things. Just as with the issue of the BP months ago, sometimes you guys dont catch everything. Often you dont see the entire picture, and (as you've told us before numerous times) you rely on feedback. Some of us were providing that feedback. Were some being assclowns about it? Entirely probable. I wasnt around for most of the crap, and some of the participants I believe I have on ignore.

But please understand that any criticism some might have of the entire issue isnt a slight on you OR Hate (again, except for a select few douchebags) but is rather trying to bring to your attention things you both may have missed, or not realized.

Ok, all that aside, to be frank I am glad to see a lot of whats been posted lately. Great ideas on fixing an item that was, in all fairness, pretty game breaking. I like what I am seeing. It also seems as if aug type selection on this new system can really help customize class roles, much in the way Hate was talking about customizing knight roles.

[Gannicus]

Continuing this path, I'm also toying with the idea of removing 50% of the Heroic Resist from UW's and spreading them out across tier armor. I'm not sure what tier I'll start at. If I start at the beginning, then it'll be small increments. The UW IX has about 900 resist? So then I'd remove 450 resist off that, and spread those 450 resist across all the tier armor, so by the time you get to T8 ToV, a full suit of armor would give you +450 Heroic Resist. And if your main tank has UW IX then that is another 450 resist for the original 900 resist that you'd have anyways. The benefit is now EVERYONE else in the raid has additional 450 resist on their toon! This bridges the gap a little bit between UW and non-UW toons as far as Resist.

+20066

Heroic stats on tiered armor is one of the things I've really wanted to see happen , and in the end, you lose nothing except gain more heroic stats across the board on your other characters

[Tankdan]

My suggestions:

-Cap the hitpoints on UW at ~1 million so all future content  in the years to come can easily be designed without some tanks having twice as many hitpoints as other tanks.
-Heroic resist idea seems ok.. but its already easy to get our alts the 2k resists or whatever it is they need. 
-I seem to be doing okay without the AOE on UW. 

[Weebles]

As for the non-hardcore players, that is probably for another topic. If there are so many of them, then they need to form guilds and work together. Work together on getting your main tank geared out, and enough healers to keep tank topped off each round. Seems the majority of the players here are hardcore, over 120 UW and only 400 online? Sort of speaks for itself how much of the server is hardcore.

Should us "non-hardcore players" leave ?

[Hunter]

As for the non-hardcore players, that is probably for another topic. If there are so many of them, then they need to form guilds and work together. Work together on getting your main tank geared out, and enough healers to keep tank topped off each round. Seems the majority of the players here are hardcore, over 120 UW and only 400 online? Sort of speaks for itself how much of the server is hardcore.

Should us "non-hardcore players" leave ?

You non-hardcore players should stop being anti social and try working together more and/or work out your boxes/classes/gear combos.

[Weebles]

As for the non-hardcore players, that is probably for another topic. If there are so many of them, then they need to form guilds and work together. Work together on getting your main tank geared out, and enough healers to keep tank topped off each round. Seems the majority of the players here are hardcore, over 120 UW and only 400 online? Sort of speaks for itself how much of the server is hardcore.

Should us "non-hardcore players" leave ?

You non-hardcore players should stop being anti social and try working together more and/or work out your boxes/classes/gear combos.

Is that what Fugi and all the others did within the first few weeks of the introduction of the UW ?

[Hunter]

If you want to know how or what Fugitive did, then ask him when you see him again.

Lets get back on topic, and stop derailing/trolling.

[Rageful]

Here's a story for everyone. Once I knew a guy named Peign who was a super cool dude. Recently I noticed he was being a huge dick. I finally realized why.

So....


If (Work hard for your shit) {
    Get rewarded
}
Else {
   Stop complaining
}

The health of the server seems fine to me.    We get new players every day.   I think more people enjoy the UW and other items that Hunter has implemented than dislike them.

The UW, as it was originally implemented does not seem game breaking.    Not quite sure a UW will out dps an NSX augged monk, ranger or free dps wizzy either.  if so, so what?   it is ultimate, it was worked for and it was certainly not given.

server ecinomy is thriving, population is up.    whats the problem.

players here are passionate and will get the gear!

moar pellets please!

lol@felony

[clbreastmilk]

I believe you still want the UW type spread yes?  Excluding the heroic resist change for tier gear...

Assuming current UW
Sword - Add AoE back, stats keep as is
Mace - Add +50% Heroic resists compared to sword (Keep heal proc maybe)
Staff - Add +100% Heroic resists compared to sword (add heal proc)
Dagger - ??
Bow - ??

I'd bet you many people would switch to mace/staff weapons for current tier content but would then love using sword while doing lower tier content.


Lowering the increases of certain stat values such as Hp and Heroic resist on Future UW ranks would help equalize some content.  I'd imagine most people would be ok with either not creating a new UW rank for Tier 10 and beyond (since no one has them, cept hunter with his XII) or a very Minimal increase on future tiers.  This would allow you to start closing the gap between what would be needed for UW and non UW boxes.  Yes, it might take a few more tiers to equalize but it would eventually happen.  This is a Huge situation you have going on, gotta think long term solution.

Adding heroic resists to Tier gear will go hand in hand with the above suggestion.  Eventually normalization will occur for your group and your warrior where UW won't be as needed and hopefully, at some point, not worth it to continue making.

[Hunter]

normalization will occur for your group and your warrior where UW won't be as needed

You realize the QQ that Warriors would do because they are no longer special after all the hard work they put in?

The UW in future content will continue to put the toon above others, especially cause of the time invested to get those.

We need to spin it a bit differently and take another approach to keep the peace.

[Adidis]

The health of the server seems fine to me.    We get new players every day.   I think more people enjoy the UW and other items that Hunter has implemented than dislike them.

Getting new players and keeping new players are two highly different things. I think UW will be a greater deterrent to players as they figure out how it is to be claimed if you are actually forced to get it. It's a step backwards for anyone who works through content without it and doesn't want to spend months farming it just to continue progression. I'm personally not interested in the idea of hitting T8 or T9 and figuring out it's impossible without back farming 7+ Tiers I already defeated for months on end then grinding out plat endlessly just so I can continue what as it sounds is intended to be doable without this.

The UW, as it was originally implemented does not seem game breaking.    Not quite sure a UW will out dps an NSX augged monk, ranger or free dps wizzy either.  if so, so what?   it is ultimate, it was worked for and it was certainly not given.

This right here leads me to believe if it was named "The Fluffy Bunny Slayer" and had the same requirements you would be fine with it being garbage. Just because the name is Ultimate doesn't mean it should be several times greater than your epic or equal your entire gear pool. It's still technically ultimate as long as it is a superior choice to your other options. I understand that it's a drastic farm and you feel entitled after you farmed and/or bought this item, but it shouldn't forcibly break the content curve because you can't accept that it's over-tuned. Granted I'm not saying remove damage. I do think shifting Heroic resists is a large step in the right direction to balancing the server without, as you guys have been saying, making the UW feel unworth. I am under the belief the other problem is the health pool it offers to you as a tank. I think that should be a much less drastic number and would make balancing content to both player types much easier. Damage checks can be overcome by just adding more guys to your squad or buddying up with other people to push content, but getting one shot because you don't meet a health check because you didn't spend months farming is just a crushing feeling. I'm fine with you guys having nice effects on them too. Heal procs, AoE clicks, Rune clicks (On decent CDs such as UC length), even a strong single target click for helping push over bosses is all gravy because it's not going to push you so much further ahead that it breaks content for those of us who don't have them and aren't interested truly interested in them til we've been there and done that with all the content.

I know not having one makes me see half the picture, but I believe just patching the huge resist and HP gap created by it will honestly help the balance of everything overall.

[clbreastmilk]

Far less QQ than removing it or nerfing currently owned UW ranks

[Hunter]

I am starting to think that it would be good idea to cap how much HP is added on them after UW IX.

I realize this would be a nerf, and yes people will QQ about it.

Right now UW IX is 1M HP, then goes 2M, 4M, 8M.

Instead of double HP, might cap to adding 500k each rank after rank IX.

Undecided for now, but good chance of doing that route on HP.

[Denzig]

Balance content around Tier gear, not the carrots. UW, RoA, SoA should not even be part of the equation since they are HUGE time sinks.

The casuals can progress with their limited time, the hardcore can play god-mode.

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