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[barrettd04]

exp mask = power glove

[littlelongbeard]

Overall, was considering making the mask effect persist through death, some stats on mask, and likely something else to make it worth while.

At this point, piss on it. The next ?OA item will simply involve farming/grinding/etc without using AAXP. Let'em stack up, rollover, and be wasted. Since change is so heavily protested against, I'll leave it be and find a new way to timesink the next ___ of the Ages item.


-Hate

That sounds like an amazing idea of having not drop after death and making max at 350% seems far and is plenty to still get decent amounts of AAs and aadding stats would make it worth having on all toons probably

[Kruciel]

Reduce mask bonus to 350% MAX and add some stats to make it wearable at all times (or make it an aug...) and look at adding some cost to the mask and changing the process we use to get it to level up.

suggested stats are HP/AC/DS/ATK/RESISTS

Hate had suggested doing this, and that could indeed just make the Mask the next "Ages" item, while turning the tide of the massive xp buff at the same time. 22 million AA's is an astonishing feat at the moment, and nobody has even reached it. Kills 2 birds with 1 stone. Of course you'd have to Crafter Flag your characters, but that's nothing but running around PoK for a few hours. Currently, everyone I know that's done with Rings already has a handful of characters flagged from doing extra Ult Weapons. Just a thought   I think the main worry at the moment is people not wanting the Ring to take 3x longer. But like I said, Hate is backed into a corner on what he can do with xp at all, whether it's making a new AA-line or trying to make high tier zones actually give AA somewhat based on how much longer the kill-per-hour ratio is compared to lower tiers. If this opens up doors to raise AA in hard zones, and do double xp events, it's not going to take you triple the amount of time. Also, it stops sending people back to old zones just to do AAs, which is a big big big big big big turn on I think we all can agree on.

[Warbash]

Warbash,

You are wanting me to refund you the cost of an item, you got plenty of use of, at full price. My issue isn't that you aren't thrilled with the changes. I'm TOTALLY fine with discourse and discussion, but basically you're saying that because you made a donation to help keep this ship sailing, you are entitled to keeping an item(s) locked in time, regardless of how absurdly problematic it may be.

Potentially, we could compromise on this. Would you be interested if the Easy Experience items became a GROUP buff (not MGB friendly, I'm not that insane...) instead of a self only? I would have to attach a cooldown of sorts, but it could be group usable AND persist through death.

Thoughts?


-Hate

That is a totally reasonable compromise:) won't do me much good as mask is at %180 but totally fair.
Thanks for listening sir

[Chunka]

Oooh!! Kind of off topic, but the perfect next "?oA" item!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfk-a1JZMbU

Cockrocket of the Ages!!

[Marcone]

If you wanted to anger the least amount of people my suggestion would be to keep the current 1% per level scaling then cut it off at whatever value you think is reasonable.  Could add an additional effect for further levels.  That's just my 2cp though.

[Kruciel]

I be all like "Hate don't nerf me bro plz"

and he be all like

[warrior5]

tl;dr - I don't agree with the need for or ramifications of an exp change.

I haven't read the whole thread, just the first page, so if this has been addressed I apologize. I have a few comments on exp:

1.) How are people getting 100k aaxp per day? I only see one possibility - I have a v2 exp clickie and get maybe a few thousand per day at most. How is 6k in 3 hours of playtime a problem? To me it seems incredibly slow considering how many AA we need and since I paid 500 for the item. If I had a v3 clickie, and paid 1000 (back when it was 1000), and I played for 24 hours straight and I am able to get to 100k per day... that sounds reasonable to me - 24 hours is an insane dangerous-to-your-health type grind and the v3 clickie costs a fortune! Not everyone pulls all of Anguish all day every day for fun - I know I don't - plus most can't. As for the mask, no one has a mask 1000 for a reason, it's an impossible amount of AA to get. Rymo is close because he's a monster, and he should be rewarded for it - the buff only lasts 1 hour so it's fun for the server when he buffs on rare occasion. Additionally, you only get to mask 1000 years after you've beaten the game and maxed your aa, so it's more of a bragging right than anything useful.

2.) I can't say I am in favor of nerfing the most expensive items on the server (by far) in any way. I didn't get the item because I wanted to grind relatively faster than the server - I got it because I did the math in my head, and I felt at the specific level it was at, and the price it was at, it made the grind into something I considered somewhat sane to a casual player instead of impossible. All of the people who did the grind with the current AA system already have their AA. All this does is reward the haves even more, and punishes future players significantly - a familiar situation. How can you cap the exp rate without rolling back huge portions of AA people have already received? It creates a massive AA imbalance between new and old players.

3.) If this does go through. I would highly recommend you offer credit to those who purchased the v1, v2, or v3 exp clickies. If I paid 1000 and then found out about this I would be mega-pissed. I'm already super unhappy about it and I only went with the 500. Update - I see this was mentioned and Hate suggested removing all the AA gained after offering credits for credits... which was originally 1,000 real US dollars and clearly helped the server... a lot.  

Although I don't believe AA is even an issue since RoA doesn't really matter on alts, and mask doesn't matter either - here is an alternate solution: Do not cap exp. Add an uber belt that sucks up AA like no other.

Sorry to get all whiny about it I know you guys work so so hard, but I've given a lot to the server through EZC going all the way back and I even plan on giving more (with the old exp system I was going to buy an upgrade for v3 along with other stuff). EZ is fun and awesome that's why I've done so, but I can't say I'm on board with this exp change at all.  

[Waraesh]

TLDR: recap!  = AA's are a decent thing, but not essential to my fun!

I guess my greatest source of confusion is the big deal surrounding the exp masks.  I am puzzled as to why it is game breaking.  Yes, Rymo's buff is massive and when he casts it, people flock to the zone it's being cast in.  (this is kind of fun to me).  Then people go out and slog through 1 hr of super buffs to see how the other half live (or the other <1% for that matter).
I am relatively new to the server, less than 10months.  But not once have I ever thought to myself...damn this is rough, I need to upgrade my team's RoA's to progress.  It has always been about getting gear or resists.  The RoA is a nice shot in the arm for the tank, but for the rest...meh.  As people continue to increase in power and the exp masks that people have rise towards the heavens (to join rymo in his crystal palace) they are going to max out their RoA's.  At which point they will start grinding towards Earrings, secondary masks (for that lag wipe on first pull of t9.   ) or they are just going to let aa's become ancillary and play the game.
I'm a grinder and I love progress, I like to see the %'s go up on my mask as I continue to mash through things.  With hate adding the text to level up wench to fix the negative exp for lowbies at 69, I think this is all but handled.  I just wanted to weigh in, please take my opinion with a grain of salt, as I said...I'm new to the community and just happy to be here with the wonderful folks and the great dev's.  <----Seriously who else do you know that works this hard for nothing other than helping out an old friend's family, much respect!

[Moruk]

I dont really have a dog in this fight, i dont give a shit about the xp mask I just *really* appreciate players giving out buffs (oak, VT, crab, etc), but I do have a solution:


First disable any new xp masks from being created.  Anyone that is possesion of the current xp mask will be grandfathered and allowed to keep their mask but the mask is limited to group only and non-MGB-able.
 
Second, create a brand new xp mask that functions as explained below.  Grandfathered users can turn in their old masks for an equivalent new mask if they so choose.

- The new mask is rank based, not percentage based.  This will allow the devs to set the actual XP percentage based off their judgement for the health of the server.  For example, instead of a Mask of Experience 360%, it would be a Mask of Experience Rank 360.  

- The click affect of the mask will spawn an npc just like the banker clicky.  ideally the npc wil be *very* tall so it can be interacted with by a large number of people, if such a model exists in the global file

- the npc will stay spawned for X minutes (5 or so)

- the name of the spawned pc will depend on who cast it, example:  Rymo's Rank 830 Experience Pet, or Kiwis Rank 330 Experience pet.  This will allow the caster to broadcast its existance and not have to wait around for everyone to show up.  They could say something like "/ooc %T pet up in nexus for 5 mins"

- the xp buff persists through death

- the mask clicky has a much longer cooldown.  One hour seems like a good start

- the xp buff's DURATION depends on what rank the mask is.  for example, a Rank 100 mask may last 15 mins, while the Rank 1000 lasts the full hour duration.  This gives incentive to keep increasing the mask to not only have a higher xp bonus but a longer duration.  

- the buff is tier based.  all of our toons are already flagged for each and every tier, so the buff could be customized to the person hailing the npc.  lower tiered people getting the buff have a higher percentage penalty.  We already have this functionality from the buff bot, it gives out buffs based on your level.

- pre level 70 would have the highest penalty.  since they have no tier flags at all, the buff could be penalized by 80%

- each consecutive tier flag would reduce the base penalty of the mask for the person hailing the spawned mask npc.  Example, a T5 flagged toon hailing the xp buff pc would only be penalized 30%, a T9 flagged toon by 5%, etc)

[Kruciel]

tl;dr - I don't agree with the need for or ramifications of an exp change.

I haven't read the whole thread, just the first page, so if this has been addressed I apologize. I have a few comments on exp:

Why would you bother with such a long post if you can't be bothered to read all of the information in the thread? This sounds like something a politician would say "I didn't listen to anything you little people have to say, but listen up because here's what I think" durrrr

1.) How are people getting 100k aaxp per day? I only see one possibility - I have a v2 exp clickie and get maybe a few thousand per day at most. How is 6k in 3 hours of playtime a problem? To me it seems incredibly slow considering how many AA we need and since I paid 500 for the item. If I had a v3 clickie, and paid 1000 (back when it was 1000), and I played for 24 hours straight and I am able to get to 100k per day... that sounds reasonable to me - 24 hours is an insane dangerous-to-your-health type grind and the v3 clickie costs a fortune! Not everyone pulls all of Anguish all day every day for fun - I know I don't - plus most can't. As for the mask, no one has a mask 1000 for a reason, it's an impossible amount of AA to get. Rymo is close because he's a monster, and he should be rewarded for it - the buff only lasts 1 hour so it's fun for the server when he buffs on rare occasion. Additionally, you only get to mask 1000 years after you've beaten the game and maxed your aa, so it's more of a bragging right than anything useful.

People are getting 100k by... nevermind I'm not going to repost what I covered already. 100k is possible right now, without 1000xp, without Rymo Mask, in about 5 hours with your average mask. Not many can pull and kill at that speed, but majority of max warriors can. The only reason to send them into AA overdrive is working on the earring. Warriors doing the ring are earning AA faster than me or Rymo, because we aren't actively hunting AAs at the moment (which means running Anguish)

2.) I can't say I am in favor of nerfing the most expensive items on the server (by far) in any way. I didn't get the item because I wanted to grind relatively faster than the server - I got it because I did the math in my head, and I felt at the specific level it was at, and the price it was at, it made the grind into something I considered somewhat sane to a casual player instead of impossible. All of the people who did the grind with the current AA system already have their AA. All this does is reward the haves even more, and punishes future players significantly - a familiar situation. How can you cap the exp rate without rolling back huge portions of AA people have already received? It creates a massive AA imbalance between new and old players.

People are entitled to opinions. Nobody wants to take a hit to xp, but the game is old and it has limits. One of the many reasons you don't get dick for xp outside of Anguish is because the game has reached its limit on what it can handle via xp scaling. The mobs gain around 600% HP moving up to Loping Plains, and even if they awarded 600% xp of Anguish mobs, you still have to run around for an hour after the trash playing an infuriating game of wack-a-mole with the bosses.

3.) If this does go through. I would highly recommend you offer credit to those who purchased the v1, v2, or v3 exp clickies. If I paid 1000 and then found out about this I would be mega-pissed. I'm already super unhappy about it and I only went with the 500. Update - I see this was mentioned and Hate suggested removing all the AA gained after offering credits for credits... which was originally 1,000 real US dollars and clearly helped the server... a lot.  

Let's stop right there. How many people actually threw down $1000 for the 1000% clicky. I have no idea how many are on the server, but I imagine the answer is 0. Ever since I started playing, Hunter had 2:1 credit options, 3:1 credit options, hell sometimes even 5:1 credit options. He used to award credits to people all the time for helping him test things or reported absolutely broken shit. Just off the top of my head I can say I got 600 from a 3:1 donation, 200 for an exploit I emailed him, and 90-100 ish for testing things over the years. ANNNNYWAYS, I've gotten ample use out of my v1 clicky over the years, when my Mask passed it I didn't care, I didn't feel cheated. v2 clicky and v3 clicky are a bit more extreme, but Hate already said he's willing to compromise IF it was a recent purchase. I'm really not going to go into this further, seriously just read the thread. Reasons are explained on why it has to happen, eventually, whether it's today or a year from now. Here's the reality of that: a year from now, people are going to be even more mad.

Although I don't believe AA is even an issue since RoA doesn't really matter on alts, and mask doesn't matter either - here is an alternate solution: Do not cap exp. Add an uber belt that sucks up AA like no other.

Sorry to get all whiny about it I know you guys work so so hard, but I've given a lot to the server through EZC going all the way back and I even plan on giving more (with the old exp system I was going to buy an upgrade for v3 along with other stuff). EZ is fun and awesome that's why I've done so, but I can't say I'm on board with this exp change at all.  

Again man, why make such a big big post if you aren't going to read. This is so stupid, formulating your point of view on a topic without even reading into why Hate wants to make the change.

Hate already gave up on nerfing the mask for now by the way, you guys can stop the QQ fest. But, in the interest of trying it again someday Hate when it actually does break the server in another year or so, you might have to explain more in depth what it's breaking, from a developer's point of view. Everyone arguing at the moment is missing the point completely on what you wanted to do with xp. They just see "NERF" and "33% XP" and fail to read the rest of the posts, or even try and figure out for themselves what you mean by "break the server" and "negative exp values" If we're going to have an actual discussion on this, we need some power-point type shit to explain to people "this is why I'm cutting your nuts off" and "these are all the ice cream flavors you can choose from afterwards"

[warrior5]

I did read the thread after I posted which is why I added an update. It's a long thread, wanted to get my 2cp out while it was fresh. Also obviously don't agree with you.

[Kruciel]

Don't agree with what exactly? Me saying that eventually it's going to have to happen? That part isn't an opinion. From where Hate's sitting he can't scale xp at all in high-tiers to put them in line with AA xp from lower tiers because it would SUBTRACT AAs from you if you used mask buffs. We're forever digging ourselves into a hole by letting it go further and further.

I can give plenty of examples on how the server could be improved to the point where you'd barely even feel a change in the end. But this thread is way too far gone for it to be thrown in at this point would be like pissing in the ocean. And as I stated in the last post, people are focusing on the wrong part of the discussion, which is the "what?" and not the "why?".

[warrior5]

Why does XP have to scale any more at high tiers? It's fine as is, T10 XP = T6 XP just like T9 = T6. New tiers can't come out more than every couple years or so anyway. Seems to me this is more of the haves wanting to lock in their share (and expand it with more xp bumps) and prevent others from catching up (consciously or not). It's one of the oldest stories on EZ, and is a microcosm of economic problems we face IRL as well. It's actually interesting to see.

Seems to me people who beat the game feel compelled to farm T6 and are pissed it detracts from their T9 or T10 time. Why does the whole server including those who paid good money to help it have to get screwed to make it even more rewarding for those who have already beat the game?

Mass farming AA in T6 is a choice. As I said not everyone wants to or even can do it. I guess we should be thankful the same guys who abused T6 when it was broken are still champing at the bit to get another leg up (not implying you K I just know a lot did).

We have a disagreement on this is all but Hate has to hear the dissent too - he asked for our opinions on this.

Edit: Just came up with another easy solution. Make crystals drop MORE often in higher tiers, instead of less. Why do crystals drop more in T6? The increase in crystal drops should occur progressively with tiers. I have no idea why they don't already. Additionally, add the uber AAXP belt and be done with it. The belt would have 1000 levels and consume 5x as much AA as the mask. Problem solved without nerfs, plus we get another thing to work on forever. Huge win for everyone.

[Kruciel]

Rofl, your general train of thought on my side of the fence couldn't be more wrong. I don't give a FUCK about AA's for myself or my crew currently, I'm done. I was actually trying to explain to Hate why people are erupting over what he suggested, because it literally would make the RoA take 3x longer. I don't want that for anybody. That does not change the fact that this is just one more situation he has to un-fuck in order to move forward with development. People that currently have RoA 1k's and beyond worked their ass off, with or without the occasional Rymo buff to speed things along. The truth to that is, I see more people with RoA 1k's than I do with v3 clickies, so it obviously isn't breaking too much on that front. I tried, time and time again, to explain the downsides of not being able to touch experience at the moment.

As for this little gem,

It's fine as is, T10 XP = T6 XP just like T9 = T6

It's fine? Tell me again how having t7 = about 1/10 the xp of t6 is fine. Tell me again how t8 is about 1/50 the xp of t6 is fine. Tell me again how t9 is about 1/20 the xp is fine. And t10, it's not even worth talking about. Mob HP has reached a new high, your xp bar doesn't even move. Just as t7 was based off your dps achieving full Ult Charm 2 + strike 9 upgrades, t10 is based around you having full Ult Charm 3 on all dps + a maxed Ult Weapon on the tank. The HP here makes t9 feel like Qvic. So no, t10 xp = t6 xp is not fine for having a well-balanced server. Having to go back to t6 to do the next ages quest after already doing it for two ages quests is not fine.

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