Upgrade/Enhance Shadowknights?

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[Xiggie | Stone]

By your post it sounds like your saying jolt has an aoe taunt component on it. If that is the case then you should have no problem holding agro off clerics since heal agro is severely reduced. My monk can hold agro off of my cleric with just melee agro.

[Murrjok]

Both Shadowknight and Paladin have 2 Aggro spells that they would normaly use for tanking. Terror of Discord is Single target for 250k hate and the same ammount of hate in AE form using Dread Gaze. Both 0.5 sec cast to prevent the spells from Locking up on a fizzle and 2 second recast.

[barrettd04]

You can be in either guild to utilize the pet as a buff-bot feature, as I'm in FG and can do it.  I'm not in CG yet.

[hateborne]

Amusing, keep warriors as best dps and main tank?

Is there a chance since you get the best of both worlds we can just give warriors a magic 100% of damage comes back as healing? I mean hell, you already have and want everything else....

Seriously, I just think we need an AoE of sorts, or some kind of stackable DoT system.

On AoE system, something that allows us to do either minor splash damage or some kind of leaping DoT that can bounce from target to target (being spread by our AoE taunt, and causing massive threat if say Target_A is infected = true, cause 2x threat). The rolling DoT system below would also be nice if an SK could spread it.

Everytime a Lifetap procs (of any sort, buffs, sorts, augs), the shadowknight builds up a DoT that does 20% (amount can be adjusted to prevent breaking SK or if dmg is too low) of the Lifetap over 9 seconds. As each Lifetap procs, the DoT timer resets and adds the new amount. This will eventually turn into a very VERY significant amount of damage, however not quick enough to make it extremely overpowered.

EX: My SK decided that Dragon Slave looked at him funny and decided to teach him a lesson. I hit the trusty auto attack button and cast my Lifetap DD that does 1300 (260 over 9), about 4 seconds later my sword procs for a 6900 (now 1640 over 9). A swing later my Discord buff procs another 600 (1840 over 9). About another 3-4 seconds and Lifetap DD is up and lands a weak 891 (2018 over 9). Suddenly my sword decides this is getting old and drops a 13800 (now 4778 over 9). Now let's skip ahead and assume every 5 seconds Discord does 600, my Lifetap DD does 1000 every 10 seconds, and sword does extra 6000 every 15.
That is (600 x 12) * 0.2 = 1440 over 9 from Discord.
That is (1000 x 6) * 0.2 = 1200 over 9 from Lifetap DD.
That is (6000 x 4) * 0.2 = 4800 over 9 from Sword.
For those of you keeping track, that brings our dot up to 12218 over 9 after the inital ~25 seconds plus our simulated 60 seconds (totaling ~85 seconds). Assuming ticks are 3 seconds a piece, our dot is doing 4072 (rounding down) a piece. Although this is still low, it allows room for it to become obscene on longer fights. This will also give us that insidious build up feeling.
Also it adds a RNG feel as 9 seconds without any type of Lifetap DD (be it nuke, sword, or discord) and the DoT fades. This will make fights slightly less mechanically and slightly more amusing. Players can (may be required) to save their Lifetap DD to ensure the DoT rolls.


Lastly, this leaves room to improve shadow knight gear with bonuses to DoT damage. I used 20% as a baseline and can obviously be turned up or down. If say T2 set had 10-20% bonus to DoTs a PIECE, then not only would the rolling DoT be useful, but the other 3 DoTs will become usable on longer fights for significant bonus as opposed to just something to cast.

Just random thoughts and such.

If this idea goes in, lemme feel your love, toss me some oracles to Verlorenen!

[Xiggie | Stone]

A tic is every 6 seconds. The idea you are suggesting is impossible within the contruct of eq if i understand you correctly.

[Murrjok]

On AoE system, something that allows us to do either minor splash damage or some kind of leaping DoT that can bounce from target to target (being spread by our AoE taunt, and causing massive threat if say Target_A is infected = true, cause 2x threat). The rolling DoT system below would also be nice if an SK could spread it.

Hmm, i know its been a while sence i played WoW, but that sounds awefuly alot like how Death Knights in WoW tank .......

[Xiggie | Stone]

On AoE system, something that allows us to do either minor splash damage or some kind of leaping DoT that can bounce from target to target (being spread by our AoE taunt, and causing massive threat if say Target_A is infected = true, cause 2x threat). The rolling DoT system below would also be nice if an SK could spread it.

Hmm, i know its been a while sence i played WoW, but that sounds awefuly alot like how Death Knights in WoW tank .......

I was thinking the same thing. That or diablo or something. Couldn't word it without throwing out a wow insult so I left it alone. Doh, there, just did it.

[Murrjok]

I wasnt insulting WoW, personaly i still like it, but that kind of System is only something WoW's spell system can handle on how it treats NPC's.

[Xiggie | Stone]

Meh, in all fairness it is a good suggestion and would be neat if it would work. It would actually be a really good benefit to all dot classes.

[hateborne]

Hmm, I understand the spreading would be obscenely difficult. However the rolling DoT wouldn't be overly difficult, unless I'm gravely mistaken. (Also I am aware WoW has a similar mechanic, I am referring to something that spreads the current dot instead of just some trash minor dot to look cool. Basically being able to spread a moderately built up DoT to other NPCs nearby [if current dot is 5000 over 18sec on Master of Weaponry and it is spread, other mobs in AoE range now have it]).

It would be something like (for single target dot): (hush Secrets, I know my C++ skills are...well what skills)
SK_AIDs_counter is a running total
SK_AIDs_spell is the total amount decreasing per tick (if such is needed)
SK_AIDs_spell_duration is hurrdurr the duration on it
spell_cast is the spell being casted
Lifetap_DD is just a junk variable to represent a test to see if spell being casted is a lifetap direct damage

Code:

void SK_AIDs
{
if spell_cast = Lifetap_DD
{
// The below gets 30% of the current damage and copy it to a dummy counter value.
    SK_AIDs_counter += spell_cast_amount * 0.30;
// The reason there is a variable above and below is this. The counter is the running total of the DoT
// amount whereas the SK_AIDs_spell is the amount left that will decrease as it ticks.
    SK_AIDs_spell = SK_AIDs_counter;
//  Assuming millisecond below, this will be for resetting the duration (aka Rolling)
    SK_AIDs_spell_duration = 1800;
}
else
    return "not a lifetap dd, bugger off";
}
 

Minor changes, as I was informed ticks are 6 seconds, change duration to 18 seconds.
Again, with ticks at 6 seconds and duration at 18 seconds, changed amount to 30% (may still need to be higher to be truly effective, probably as high as 45% but probably no higher as it could lead to eventual stupidity mode later).


I apologize for any breach of coding etiquette or form. I am just a gimp beginner in C++ so ...yeah, sorry.

-Hateborne/Verlorenen


EDIT: After 3 quick 1min autoattack sessions with chambersb practice dummy, 15-25% is more appropriate. Assuming 30% of Lifetaps into DoT with 3.0, all AAXPs (1149), qvic gear with tacvi chest/feet, and oracle L4 charm: in 2 of the 3 one minute combat rounds, the DPS bonus was roughly 900 (+/- 100). Obviously with longer combat the DoT could easily spiral WELL out of control at 30%. However, this has potential to turn SK into a build up DPS that although will not touch warrior burst/aoe in the slightest, will do much needed things for the longer duration fights.

Below is the first round of the one minute fight sessions. This is why 30% is probably too high. This is again, short off-hand math with very small test data. I do not claim PERFECTION or mastery of my suggestion, just to help clarify and such.

-For Numbers People-
Sword: 6900 x 7 = 48300 * 0.30 = 14490
14490 over 18 sec at 6 sec between ticks: 14490 / 3 = 4830 per tick or 805 dps
Discord Buff: (529 x 6) + 1058 = 4232 * 0.30 = 1269   (1058 was crit)
1269 over 18 sec at 6 sec between ticks: 1269 / 3 = 423 per tick or 70 dps
Nuke: 1184 x 5 = 5920 * 0.30 = 1776
1776 over 18 sec at 6 sec between ticks: 1176 / 3 = 532 per tick or 65 dps.

Total damage for the rolling DoT would have been 17535 over 18 seconds. That breaks down to 5845 a tick or 974 dps over 1 minute.

[trendkiller]

very well laid out, this could be an acceptable option but I might be missing the obvious...what about single mob encounters, it doesnt seem to offer any upgrade. Then again I am wayyy tired. any other ideas?

[trendkiller]

NM i just REread everything, if that stacking AE dot would be possible to code in..that would work very nicely I think. I do think that the numbers on the 3.0 should still reflect that of the dual wielders getting double the HP and other stats. A pretty good upgrade back in the day is when Hunter took my suggestion and made the 2hs tradable to 1hs to allow for bashing and better stats with an offhand. But to my knowledge no shield of other holdable offhand matches the stats off the 3.0, it was a good patch but not a final solution. Now since Paladins have had a superior upgrade to balance, something similar should be in order for the SK's

all good suggestions so far in this thread =)

[hateborne]

Unless there are some either high end bonuses to lifetap through gear or some exceptional SK-only augs with a high single target lifetap, 30% may honestly be the right amount. I am just watching and kind of guesstimating high warriors and rangers...and hell, 30% may even be low.

Basically, we need to find out what all exists in t2/t3/t4 for shadow knights and augs, and then do some theorycraft (well technically, theoryquest'ing I suppose).

The Lifetap Rolling DoT (which I have amusing been calling Sineous Touch) would do very well to be disease based. For further exceptional use of coding, I am unsure but would like to see if a mechanic is possible to allow it do a minor resistance check and convert the damage to poison. (i.e.: Fippy Darkpaw has a 50 in poison resist but 75 in disease. Sineous Touch applies itself as a poison based DoT.)

However the above about differing or "intelligent" spells are just something that caught my attention.


I would greatly appreciate Secrets, Akkadius, or possibly Hunter taking a peek into my pseudocode and into current state of game to see if a rolling DoT proc'ed/started from lifetaps is possible.

Regardless, I would like to see some Lifetap augments. That would help the shadow knights a good deal.


Thank you.
-Hateborne/Verlorenen

[yellowbird]

What you suggest would require how spells function to be rewritten.

Hunter and Akkadius don't code in C++.

[Xiggie | Stone]

Hunter has also mentioned before that SK's have a super life tap. I doubt he would do something that would make it even greater than it is

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