T7 Discussion (Merged)

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[Hunter]

Loping Plains is outdoors, so you should be fine. I haven't edited their hp or melee damage.

Guess we'll have to wait and see how it works out.

[Peign]

I wouldnt think everyone would expect to resist all the spells.   However someone with ROA 500 and UW 8-9 should be able to.   Both of those items took quite a bit of time and effort to obtain. 

Not everyone on the server will obtain those items. 

[Hunter]

For players that don't have time for RoA500 + UW9 then need to do old school style of having Clerics in the group. You'll be fine.

[Xiggie | Stone]

The unresistible charm is one that really gets me. No matter how well prepared I am for the zone the moment my tank gets charmed my group is toast. Oh sure, my warrior will make it through the charm and once it breaks I can resume attacking with him and even rez the rest of my group, only for charm to come back around and start over. My warrior will not have the dps needed to kill the bosses by himself, especially the 7.0 boss. With the bosses regen like it is when charm wears off the mob will be full hp again so it is not just a whittle it down type thing. Maybe if charm was resistible it would be better. Even on floor 1 my monk was getting trampled by 3 or 4 mobs in ToFS. If that is any indication of what will happen with my group then I won't have clerics or paladins to heal my warrior or other toons.

[Hunter]

I'll consider adding resist checks to charms.

[Xiggie | Stone]

As a suggestion, to go with the dynamic it seems as if though you are looking for maybe heroic resists could be something to look at. You could add heroic resists to the UCv2 to kind of give people a leg up if they put in the time to get one. Then you could add heroic stats to each piece of armor in T7 as well as the 7.0. The epic and bp would have a larger amount of HR than the rest of the gear just because they are both revered as greater than say arms, or feet. You also may consider adding in a 6.5 with some HR on it but not as good as the 7.0. If it is possible a bard song that adds HR. As you progress through the zone and get the gear with the HR things become a bit easier as they should. By the time you finish you should resist most of the stuff most of the time. T8 comes out and adds a little bit more to the HR thereby allowing you to go back with even more ease as is par for this server.

Thank you for the consideration and response.

[Hunter]

I could see about adding Heroic resist to ranked items like RoA, SoA, Mana Necklace, UC, etc, they would all add up, so would have to be only a little bit per item/rank.

[Fugitive]

Basically, after completing T7 (UW9) and moving on to T8+, then coming back is pretty much God Mode by being able to resist almost everything. Sort of like any other old tier you go back to and run around invincible.

This argument is invalid,  you went from normal progression to requiring the RoA and UW... Fuck, if I waste retarded amount of hours farming ULTIMATE WEAPON.. or the 440, 000 AA needed for max ROA.. there should be an incentive. Making players make this grind as normal progression is ZERO fun.. I know you're the GM but you should roll 6 box and engage in the game and really see the VERTICAL TREADMILL you have created with end game no reward..

Just like the new aug combine for the 7.0s this totally fucked end game guys getting 7.0s then DPS dropping until they could fund another aug...most avg players will shit themselves when then finally get a 7.0 then turn it in and all augs or lack essences tottaly just crumble thier team.

And yes /afk is option for me cause I do have a loud vulgure mouth that will get me in trouble. And I don't want to end up on the wrong side of a hammer..

The average players don't even know how much this screws them... The RNG of the pops and RNG of getting same loot 5+times in a row..

It takes me 4 hrs to reap rewards from the zone. 2.5hrs to clear snd 1.5 chasing spawns down.... This zone won't even pay out for players (avg players) for 3-5hrs.. asking someone to commit that much time with zero rewards harder spells is asking much...

This is from phone will edit later on machine

I vote no to these spell changes even though there is not a vote. Maybe T8 but you have players just now breaking in barely scraping by and asking them to change thier end game group make up now is really late............
??.......
??..

I know you're reasonable that is why I care so much. ? I hope you can do the right thing and not ask the server to farm like the 5-8 of us that get nuts in game

[Brokyn]

I'll start off by saying that I have 18 toons that all have UC2, all have full 7.0 epics with full Strike 9 augs.  Most of them are full T7 with the exception of needing a few single bracers, and a couple of accessories.  My 2 warriors and 1 SK have Shield 40, and my main tank has UW8.  I have 3 clerics, 2 paladins, and a Shaman for healing in 3 groups.

I zoned in to Loping Plains today, fully buffed my toons, and proceeded to attack the 4 mobs just outside zone in.  I managed to live through the pull, but 11 of my 18 toons were killed within about 10 seconds.  I didn't resist any spells on any of the toons, including the one with UW8...  The Mage 7.0 and Bst 7.0 pets were dead in the blink of an eye (they should be able to live in T8, or there is no point to them)

IIRC, there were a list of items that were NEVER going to be part of progression, they were going to be optional for people who wanted to be more powerful...  I could be wrong, but I think the list includes UC, UCv2, SoA, SoT, UW...

If the zone is tuned and balanced for the current server content, then a raid of 3 groups should be able to zone in, with Full T6 gear and 6.0 weapons (without optional gear) and be able to kill the first group of mobs they encounter.  Maybe they have to use crowd control for a pull of 4, but they should be able to do it with that gear.  By the time they have some T7 gear and a couple of 7.0s they should be able to pull 4 and live.  In T6 gear they should have a chance to resist the spells, not 100%, but some chance.  By the time they are in full T7 gear they should almost always resist the spells.

If a raid of 18 toons with full T7 gear, and every possible piece of optional gear, they should absolutely own the zone, with no questions asked.

Please return T7 to the way it was, until a more reasonable implementation of changes can be worked out.

Hunter, I ask that you take a look at this zone.  Create yourself a group of toons that have T6 gear with reasonable amounts of upgrades (SoA on tank, UC2 on a few, etc) with no UW at all.  Work out spells, and resists (adding heroic resists to current gear might be a way) and make it so you can kill there...  As it stands, the game ends at T6 for about 99.9% of the server.

If you have a test server, I would be happy to have my 18 toons copied over and their gear set back to T6 to help you do some testing.

I thank you for all that you do for us, and I am sure this will get worked out.

[1flytrapp]

+1 Brokyn . if the 1st 3 mobs done that to you. then killing bosses will be impossiable

[Hunter]

Seems I might have to reduce the damage on the spells, and maybe even their melee too to balance it out.

There will be spells. Just need to guess to balance so people can survive.

Going to bed, will work on it tomorrow.

[Sarthin]

Can't be easy to find a compromise for the difficulty of the content. Thank you Hunter for trying to work this out. It only seems fair that the people with the optional gear as Brokyn put it, should stand a higher chance of succeeding in the zone. I understand people like Fugitive totally, on the other end, kudos to you Hunter for trying to make this challenging. It must be tough to balance things out when you have regular geared people and quite a few uber geared people like Fugitive, Brokyn's army and so on.

[Fugitive]

Blarr, Brokyn, Brunna (spellin) Groups are Devastating nightmares laying waste in front of them, also they are geared way above and beyond what a "normal" above casual player will ever be geared, and they getting their asses handed to them.. These guys, not me are your best players. I just not-so humbly keep up(gear wise) and stay vocal (i.e. Troll)

Instead of being head strong about putting these spells on T7 so quickly.. why not look why ToFS is failing (same group'ish of spells) then pace yourself with adding spells to the zone or save them for T8.

-Factors that are breaking the game Why you see so many End game  or almost end game folks

-OT 2million every few hours. (There is no PVP and there will never be any no matter what people try to say to keep a 2m drop in game. A player with UWs can just lock it down) ( this needs to be reduced to 2x250k gems if it is to stay imo) ( /stick 5 behind /attack on)

-BUs which you fixed already. They pushed 60%+ of the server way beyond what they would have ever accomplished and a light-speed rate.

-Carrots like the 1 EZ Credit in ToFS? Seriously you want me to spend 100-200+ hrs keying my goons that are already done with the game for 1 EZ Credit. The players that can "Kill" Tsserrina already probably have most of the clickies and whatever else "donor" items. ( and only players probably able to kill this boss is Agony/Stained and Magister.

- Server is taking a dangerous curve to being "need Donor equipment to do anything here server"..

- This list can go on and on but stopping now cause I'm not intentionally trying to piss in your Cheerios.


I know you are asleep and going to look @ stuff when have a clear head, I'm just typing my frustrations and venting without trying to step on a peepee here or there..






btw.


I log on to have fun, shoot the crap with a group of players I consider friends.

I log on to get a sense of accomplishment not feel like a full time job to just gear up through a tier.

Lately I log on and get locked in a 4+ hour run just to hopefully get a item I may or may not need.. results don't even start paying out till 2+ hours that I get locked into. That in itself is a large commitment.


I can't find myself to log on just to "hope" I can clear a mob or boss that is "way beneath me" ...

I can't find myself to log on when being a new person here(if I was one) .... is.. close to impossible in my eyes to catch up without Massive PLing from end'ish game players.




The Treadmill is near Vertical and you still want people to get on and play/donate/have fun... We need a safety net

[Kwai]

I agree with some of Broklyn's idea

Create yourself a group of toons that have T6 gear with reasonable amounts of upgrades (SoA on tank, UC2 on a few, etc) with no UW at all.

But would modify it as follows:

Create yourself a group of toons that have T6 gear with no upgrades (SoA, UC, UC2) and no UW at all.  Those items were not supposed to be required to progress so any zone should be doable without them.

Lots of good points made in this thread, but the overriding theme should always be "is the zone tuned for the fresh arrival who isn't God Mode geared".  IMO it was very hard for my 18 when they zoned in the first time.  I don't (and won't) have SOA or UW but do have 18 UC (1&2) and can assure you the zone was still a challenge the first few weeks until I geared them up.  If I had tried this zone without the UCs then I would have been stopped at the first 4 mobs.  That's with clerics and pallys in each group.  These changes stop me again.

You asked the question why put spells on the mobs if they are going to be 100% resisted.  I'll ask, why put spells on mobs that wipe entire raids of non God Mode players?  and ... Why should regular players even bother playing the game if it's tuned to challenge and kill the God Moders?

I'm sure it's frustrating to see your content beaten, but from the non uber grinder point of view it's doubly frustrating since my chosen game just shut me down on a whim.  Leveling up gear in a zone has always been the key to minimizing effort and maximizing reward in every game I have played so please do not penalize those who have done it by rewriting the level of difficulty.  I'd like to get back to farming bane weapons and augs.

Thanks

Dokk/Bronc

[Xiggie | Stone]

I knew this thread would get attention after these changes went live. I will not be up there as long as charm is in there. It is an extremely annoying feature that I detest. Fear and DT fit into the same slot as charm, all annoying and game ending for me as they make it not fun. Putting spells in that my 1500+ resist warrior would not be able to resist is silly because it is balancing content against something that was said to never be balanced against. I put a large part of my progression on hold and farmed a UW so that I could do the zone with 6 toons instead of having to gear 3 groups. As it is right now even if I did get 3 groups up with all optional gear I would still get my ass handed to me. Going to give it a few days to see if this gets unbroken before I move on but if this is the way it is going to I am going to go find something fun to do.

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